June 26, 2025 • 43 mins
D'Arcy Waldegrave returned to wrap another day of sports news! Highlights for tonight include:
College Sport Wellington director Bryan Dickinson and Wellington Rugby Referee Association chair Ian Dallas on the ref abuse incident in Horwhenua-Kapiti.
Talkback - is the HKRFU taking the right approach to solve the ref abuse problem?
Supercars driver Matt Payne on next year's NZ double-header?
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Sports Talk podcast with Dancy Waldegrave
from News Talk zed B.
Speaker 2 (00:42):
H O.
Speaker 3 (00:57):
Here we are radio today. I had to fight hited
the Placey Ellen for the headphones, Hughes, forgive them to me. Plainly,
she won the fight. That's why I'm so late. I'm
beaten and bruised by the award winning drive host. Now
I had it coming. Hello, I'm Darcy Watergrove. Seven minutes
(01:21):
after seven. It is on our Thursday night, June twenty six,
twenty twenty five. This is Sports Talk. We talk sport
from now through until eight o'clock tonight. We're going to
talk more rugby, more misbehavior, more sanctions, more drama at
a grassroots level in rugby union here and now t
(01:42):
and of course theys. We know it is our national game.
This is important. Water the dirt flowers last for you. Sorry,
listen to Williams to steal that line. But it's true.
Got to look after this level to keep the top running. Well.
(02:02):
Not this level. Is this level is refereeing at the
grassroots because without the rest, we don't got a game none.
You understand now the referees are getting abused. If the
referees are getting jostled, if the referee, if the referees
get sick of this, there's no more rugby. And this
happened last night when Corey Kennett joined us, the head
(02:24):
of Hotopania Carpety Rugby. So that right, that's it. We're
stopping rugby this weekend. We told you once don't behave
like Dix and if you do, we're going to stop rugby.
And they did. It's been quite a bounce back after that.
We're going to cover that off today. We and to
take more of your cause I've got a angle or
two that I'd like to serve at you to see
(02:46):
what we've got back. And look, I promise we're going
to talk to Matt Pain yesterday and it didn't happen.
That's okay. We'll roll with Matt tonight for the supercar
fans out there, But initially on the program we have
got well, we've got a couple of names for you
to look through what's happened over the last twenty four hours.
(03:09):
Will be joined by Brian Dickinson. First, he runs College
Sport in Wellington. Around that decision, what happened, what occurred
to the best of his knowledge, and then we'll go
to in Dallason at Wellington Referees and find out what
the effect this is having on him and his representatives
and on his volunteers, and then we'll take your call.
(03:32):
So like one hundred and eighty ten eighty, that, my friend,
is what we plan. So that is what we're going
to do. But first.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
Sport today and in sport today, nothing to see here,
nothing at all, despite the decisions from hood. If a
company rugby CEO that referee abuse from the sidelines is
an epidemic in New Zealand, it isn't in Canterbury at least,
says the CEO.
Speaker 3 (04:03):
Tony Snail.
Speaker 4 (04:04):
We get an incident once a year that we need
to deal with.
Speaker 5 (04:07):
We're talking to someone to crack at the referee verbally,
it's far from an epidemic inside Canterbury.
Speaker 3 (04:12):
Okay, Quevy cyclist Lewis Smala has scored himself a pro
cycle contract. I have been promoted from Gripama if the
Jay's development team. He's a chance for a grind to
a spot with difficult like thirty old people trying to
jam into eight rides. So be it so his lure
or the lure of the Olympic Games. Just like it
(04:35):
isn't as strong as you'd think.
Speaker 1 (04:37):
It's not like a big goal of mine. From a
lot of sports. The pinnacle is the Olympics. For cycling,
it's kind of just like a bonus of then.
Speaker 3 (04:43):
But yeah, it'd be super special to represent the country
at the Olympics.
Speaker 6 (04:47):
Right now, I'm just focusing for the on the road
cycling scene in Europe.
Speaker 3 (04:51):
I want to do the tour of France and the
tour to everything else and make the big bucks. Then
I might try and pick up a medal. Good on you.
Harkypyw Zealand is hailing the means that black sticks culture
as being instrumental in their success, even though they've hardly
played over the last year. But when they do get
this sticks out, they win. Acting chief executive.
Speaker 7 (05:12):
Kim Mapleston, they have an incredibly strong team culture and
they work on that really, really hard even when they're
not together.
Speaker 1 (05:18):
So even though the team may not be physically together
every week, they connect a lot through all the digital
platforms that we.
Speaker 3 (05:24):
All use these days. And for you hoop fans out there,
the number one pick in the NBA draft is he
young and nearly as young as Lebron James when he
was the number one pick way back when the eighteen
year old main product Cooper Bag understands the pressure though,
but he thinks he knows the steps through.
Speaker 8 (05:43):
My way that I deal with pressure and I deal
with expectations.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
Is just using the people around me. Is you know,
using my parents, using my brothers, using my friends from
back home.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
It's been with me every step of the way, and.
Speaker 7 (05:52):
That's my supports and that's how I deal with things
like that. So you know, just trying to breathe is
definitely not easy, but it's something you got to deal with.
Speaker 4 (05:58):
And that's sport today.
Speaker 9 (06:01):
Eleven minutes after seven, let's get amongst the rugby dramas
around the referee abuse from the soiline which kicked off,
yes the day out of a couple of weeks back,
but it was put into place, the hammer came down,
the trigger was pulled and Hotto for our carpety Rugby decided.
Speaker 3 (06:18):
To close the shop, if you will this weekend after
sideline abuse. We're going to go now to the College
Sport Wellington executive director Brian Dickinson to take a look
at this good evening. Brian, welcome, into the program. You,
of course, are the executive director of College Sport, Wellington.
(06:41):
You've issued a release earlier today saying you stand in
full support of the referees with the recent decision made
by hot Fur Company Rugby Football Union to defer all
those rugby matches. So in support of this decision, the
secondary schools on the Company Coast have collectively agreed to
defer their schedule rugby fixtures as well. So is this
(07:03):
on your watch? Is this something they sided through you
or something they kind of had to do because of
what happened up at the Company Coast game.
Speaker 7 (07:13):
Yeah, I mean, ultimately the schools have made that decision.
We agree with it and support that decision. But it's
always good to get to a position where the schools
are making the decisions and taking on themselves. But no,
that was certainly sitting with the schools.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
So why just the Kapiti Coast area and Amana College
were a part of this, But why just that particular region?
How many schools does this actually affect? Brian?
Speaker 7 (07:36):
Yeah, that was the bit that we have been grappling
with today. So our competition, we've got forty two secondary
schools in our region covering Wellington and Horror Funeral Cavity,
and we do have a couple of schools that come
into our competition as well, and really trying to figure
out how do we support the referees and Horroofenaic Cavity's decision,
(07:59):
but drawing a circle around you know, what what is
if he can what's not. So we feel that's the
right with We feel like it's fallen in the right
place with the Horror fenwic Kempety school's supporting the decision
College obviously because it was involved the incident on the weekend,
but the other secondary school sport will go ahead of
(08:20):
Rugby will go ahead on the weekend.
Speaker 3 (08:21):
What engagement have you had with Wellington Rugby around this,
because plainly you're looking at college sport only you can't
go any further. Do you need their backing? Do you
need ends ours backing to make a call like this, Brian.
Speaker 7 (08:37):
No, we don't need specifically their backing, but certainly we've
been keeping Welling to Rugby in the loop.
Speaker 3 (08:42):
I mean even even they were affected.
Speaker 7 (08:44):
Where there's junior Horror Fenway Cavity teams that they're playing
a combined regional competition. Now those clubs on the coast.
Junior clubs made the call to stand their teams down
this weekend, so essentially there was secondary schools on the
coast have made the same decision.
Speaker 3 (09:01):
Do they still have any effects long term? Because the
whole idea behind what if you know a carpet you
have been doing to try and put a line under
this end bolting, and we're not going to do this anymore,
and this is maybe the only way we can actually
shake people out of their funk to listen to us.
Do you think this will work? Is this going to
have any effect? Hopefully?
Speaker 7 (09:21):
I'm sure everyone Corey included hopes that this is one off.
It sends the right signal to be able to pull
leads on the sidelines. Can't guarantee that, but hopefully that
is the case.
Speaker 3 (09:32):
I suppose it comes down to when you look at
all these school kids, well, how many school kids are
going to be affected over this weekend and the last
weekend before the holidays a couple of hundred ie. Presumingly
they'll be upset, but their parents and caregivers will be going, hey,
hold on, this is not right, and maybe that pushes
them into action sidelines and they go no, We're not
going to put up with us anymore. I mean, that's
(09:53):
the idea, isn't it.
Speaker 4 (09:54):
It is.
Speaker 7 (09:55):
I've mean across those Catholic schools and now we've got
six secondary school teams that had games this schedule this weekend.
I'm conscious that some of those teams, for one reason,
they haven't acually play for the last two or three
weeks because of weather and what not. So this is
a pretty bitter pill to swallow for some of those
schools or teams that weren't involved in this, that essentially
(10:15):
won't have a game for a month or so until
we come back into term three. This is a small
number of spectators that are not behaving in the proper way.
We don't want to cast all spectors. Secondators on the
sideline are acting untoward. But yeah, yeah, we've got to
just see in the right signals.
Speaker 3 (10:34):
You say, so, you say spectators, Brian. From from what
I can gather, it was a coaching staff, the referees
as opposed to sideline spectators. It's all very muddled and
foggy because none of us are there. But to the
best of your knowledge, what actually occurred there.
Speaker 7 (10:51):
Yeah, I'll see praying out in two shoes, and one
thing I should say is horror find or copy. Because
this game happened in there in their PU area, they
take the lead. It's their judicial process. We're here to
support that exactly like we words if this had happened
and way from Rugby's region. So two things happen on
the weekend within the game. One is around the sideline behavior,
(11:12):
poor language and getting stuck into the referee, and the
other one is around an instant between the coach and
the referee. If you separate the two things out the
coach referee side of things, that'll go through a hearing
with horror capity. That hearing hasn't been held yet, and
so we'll respect that process and both sides can put
their put in the case forward and horror feneralickevity can
(11:33):
work their way through it. As far as just the
straight sideline behavior, that's essentially the principal reason why those
those games have been called off this weekend.
Speaker 3 (11:43):
I think was there like how many people were engaged
in that and was it It didn't result in people
punching or throng. It was basically just just foul language
abuse from the sideline, And was this was that a
couple of people at group. What was the deal then?
Speaker 7 (11:56):
Yeah, correct, I mean I don't think it was it
was hundreds of It certainly wasn't hundreds of people. That
was scattering of people would probably be the best way
to describe it. So no, it wasn't. It wasn't and
all in and certainly the other incident is confined to
just the coach and the referee and whatnot.
Speaker 3 (12:15):
What's the reaction been from the company, Coast teams and
from Manor College themselves. Have they come back to you
with anything? Are they taking this well?
Speaker 7 (12:26):
Yeah, I mean on the coast, I don't know if
you've seen in the social media there's that ground sask for.
Certainly the clubs are on board with it and the
schools are supporting it as well. So what again, it
was the incision to call us off. We agree with it.
We think that's the right outcome. But those the schools
are fully on board.
Speaker 3 (12:45):
Talking with Corey Kenna did yesterday saying hey, go this
is a problem all over New Zealand. This is not
just around our district or area. Do you back that up?
This is actually a general issue on the ground right
across the mountain.
Speaker 7 (13:00):
I think sidelent behavior is an issue as across all sports.
To be honest, Rugby certainly has it's for a share
of it. I wouldn't say it has a monopoly on it.
Certainly standards could be improved. I don't want to overstate it.
Speaker 3 (13:13):
Well.
Speaker 7 (13:13):
I mean we certainly have great sideline behavior as well.
We just have to keep dealing with specific issues they
as they arise, and I mean to Corey's point, we
appreciate that they've had issues within club fixtures and it
just happened that this incident on the weekend happened to
involve schools. So yeah, that's what's triggered this decision.
Speaker 3 (13:34):
So college sport Wellington, I have no coveredy rugby union.
Should this be actually in their court? Should New Zealand
Rugby actually be showing some form of leadership here and
maybe issuing their own edits as to what's acceptable and
what's not because this is their game, surely they should
be ruling not necessary than I in first but going hey,
(13:54):
we're going to do this, it's worked behave. Is that
too much to ask that they take the need?
Speaker 4 (14:00):
I think they are leading.
Speaker 7 (14:02):
We cover all sports in the Wellington Secondary School space
look at the judicial process across the various sports. I
do believes on rugby has got the most robust and
well organized judicial process and they work their way through it.
Could they be tougher on behavior? I guess we probably
all could. I mean that's probably a conversation, but I
(14:23):
mean certainly on rugby's coming out today in support of
the decision, you know, I mean ultimately it boils right
down to club, school and and individual responsibilities as well.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
To get the riffs call.
Speaker 8 (14:34):
You make the call on.
Speaker 1 (14:37):
Sports Talk on your home of Sports News.
Speaker 3 (14:40):
Talks and there it is part one of the two
part story around the referring dramas that we've had in Dallas.
Is going to join us shortly Wellington rugby referees at
BOSS as we look into this issue and just joining
us on the program. Then, was Brian Dickinson, head of
(15:03):
College Sport Wellington kind of clarify the issue here? But
I suppose right at the point at end, other referees
they're the ones that take this stick. They're the ones
that to deal with this for nothing, well they might
do they get a whistle, maybe a hat and a
T shirt or just endless grief. Why would you sort
(15:24):
of talk about that. We're joined now by in Dallas
in what do you make of this?
Speaker 5 (15:32):
Well, we obviously totally support horror and it's horrible to
think that it's come to this and they've had the
web all to make this massive decision because it affects
a lot of people, a lot of people who have
trained and organized and managed players, etc. And families supporting
it are all going to miss out. And that's hugely
(15:53):
just supporting in itself. But I think, you know, particularly
with the issues that they've had up there this year,
more than ever.
Speaker 4 (16:01):
Somewhere along the line, you've got to draw a line
in the sand.
Speaker 5 (16:04):
And to do this, I think it's fantastic and we
support them totally in that regard.
Speaker 3 (16:08):
You say issues up there, as historically they've had a
bad time of sideline referee abuse. Is this something that's
quite common.
Speaker 4 (16:17):
To the area or now?
Speaker 5 (16:19):
I don't think they are any different than anywhere else really,
I mean, I would imagine everywhere has had the issues
over over time, just that unfortunately for them, this year
is really highlighted and they've had a couple of seemingly
horrendous issues earlier on where people have been threatened and
when it gets to that level, that's just totally unacceptable
(16:41):
and someone's going to do something. So to see that
actually up a province is happy to get behind their
referee association and to make this kind of a step
is terrific because protecting people who are out in the
middle or even aar on the sideline or any other
official any other sport, they've got to be protected and
they've got to be able to enjoy the sport that
(17:01):
they enjoy as much as people playing it. And if
people on the sideline are not allowing that, well, it's
a horrible scenario.
Speaker 3 (17:09):
Do you think let's all have an effect that we
will notice as far as people responding from the sidelining, Hey,
you're actually wrecking our weekend now, you guys, you've got
to stop. Does this need to occur to maybe create
that groundswell of rejection amongst the good spectators to stop
this occurring.
Speaker 5 (17:29):
Yeah, I totally agree with it in that regard, because
we can't just keep paying lip service to this kind
of thing, and people very quickly forget the little little
things we may do to try and stop this, you know,
banning someone from being on the sideline, which can you
or can't you do that?
Speaker 4 (17:46):
People just turn up anyway.
Speaker 5 (17:47):
So for a whole association and province to stand up
and make this very very public is a great start
because we're all in this together and everyone's got to
be joining together to stop it. And the more that
other members that public feel the emboldened to say something,
to turn.
Speaker 4 (18:05):
Around and go lock, hey, do you want to happen?
And again, what happened last weekend? We had no rugby
at all. Just cut it out.
Speaker 5 (18:11):
The more people are in bold and to stand up
and stop that kind of thing, the better it's got
to be.
Speaker 4 (18:16):
But so something of this level is gold. I believe in.
Speaker 3 (18:21):
Your role as the one of the Rugby Referees Association chairman,
do you see an effect on the amount of young
referees who want to get into the sport but are
put off by such actions on the sidelind Does this
have a palpable effect on your ability to recruit people
into the role.
Speaker 4 (18:41):
I'm sure it does.
Speaker 5 (18:42):
We've got no exact data around that, but where we
find it is around retaining referees. We lose referees, not
on a regular basis, but now and again, and it
still happened this year as well. Where referees have said
is because of the abuse, they're stepping away, and I'm
sure it does make it harder for us to actually
(19:05):
recruit as well. People will hear that sitting on the
sideline if they're players themselves, and that's where we'd love
to get more referees from.
Speaker 4 (19:12):
But if they know what goes on and go like,
I would never do that. I don't want to be
involved with that.
Speaker 5 (19:17):
Or have to suffer that kind of behavior. Well, it
certainly does impact on us. And we're as short of
referees this year as we have ever been.
Speaker 3 (19:25):
You say, as short as what are we looking at here?
The potential for games just not to go ahead because
there are no officials.
Speaker 4 (19:33):
In That's absolutely correct.
Speaker 5 (19:35):
There's a lot of games, not every weekend, but a
lot of weekends where we just cannot supply referees because
our numbers are so short, and those games only go
ahead if there's perhaps someone who's had an associate referee
course that they've done and able to referee contested scrums.
Speaker 4 (19:51):
The odd parent might get involved at lower levels, but I.
Speaker 5 (19:55):
Know and I'm aware of a lot of them saying, look,
we just don't want to do this anymore. We get
such a hard time. So yes, a tough one and as.
Speaker 3 (20:04):
Far as he's in Rubia concerned that because this is
their game, they are the overlords, they run it all.
Are you satisfied with what they provide as far as
input to stopping this kind of behavior? Are they effective
in that role?
Speaker 5 (20:21):
I don't think they're do as much overtly as they
could do. They're always supportive, but I think you know,
there comes a time when.
Speaker 4 (20:29):
They need to lead a lot of it.
Speaker 5 (20:31):
You know, they are the overriding of the game and
this is a big issue. Referee numbers right throughout New
Zealand are down and if they can lead it and
drive that down through the provincial unions, well then that's
just got to be a good thing. So yeah, I'd
like to see some more avert leadership from them in
that regard.
Speaker 1 (20:50):
You hear it from the biggest names and sports and men.
Speaker 10 (20:53):
Have your sale always eighty eighty Sports Talk or more
on your home of sports news Talks Aye six.
Speaker 3 (21:01):
This is Sports Talk. It was in Dallas, Wellington rugby
referee boss has thought someone's gone down over the last
of twenty four hours in Rugby. A few points out
of those last two conversations, I'd like to expand on
with of course your involvement. I was going to say help,
but I really need help with your assistance, with your engagement.
(21:23):
Oh eight hundred eighty ten eighty. You've got the ability
to talk back talk at so please do two things.
There's in the newsroom today. There's been a lot of conversations,
had a lot of phone calls made to various CEOs
of various pus up and down the country to get
(21:45):
people to talk on tape to express their opinions and
with the views of their pu anyway around. What's happening
here And one of the biggest questions coming from the
reporters in this building is this an epidemic. This is
what the CEO of a company ted yesterday. It's an
(22:05):
epidemic referee abuse in this country. Now, as you heard
in Sport today, the CEO off Canterbury said was not
we're fine one or two year, that's about it. We're sweet,
it doesn't happen here. A lot of the other CEOs
didn't want to come on in. We want to talk
about it. We talked yesterday about it's being brushed under
(22:26):
the carpet, brushed under the rug and Corey cannet, we've
got someone who's wanting to stand up and go, well, no,
it is an issue and we can't deal with it anymore,
so we're going to do something. So I can't speak
for these CEOs. I don't know what happens around the
grounds on a weekly basis in rugby. And Corey says
it's an issue, and then some of these people said, no,
(22:47):
it isn't. But don't know who to believe nown even
if we can believe in the people on the ground
right although we know there's three sides to every story,
my side, your side, and the truth sits somewhere in between.
But from your experience, is this an epidemic? Is this
a genuine problem in you seeling rugby? And I'm going
(23:07):
from not maybe not rip a rugby, but up to
seeing your rugby in your experience as a player, as
a volunteer, as a parent, as a guardian. What do
you see at the games? What do you hear at
the games? I want to hear from people at the
bottom of the country, at the top of the country,
to the west and to the east. Is this an epidemic.
(23:30):
Is there a problem with abuse from the sideline directed
at referees? That's question one. If you're a referee, I'd
love to hear from you what are you experience maybe
how you get rid of it as well? Second thing,
and this is something I've been a bit hod on recently.
(23:50):
This is the sole responsibility of z ARE, isn't it.
What should they be doing? And we just heard them
from Ian Dallas saying, well, they kind of need to
do more. And this is like, I don't think people
want to roundly point a finger at in z ARE.
It's a small community. I don't want to upset the overlords,
now do they? But if it takes a small union
(24:14):
to actually do something really should be getting done by
the national body, you start asking questions and scratching your head,
don't you Like Our first guest did say that they
do a good job. Their judicial process is fantastic. This
is Brian Dickinson. But you get the feeling they could
(24:36):
do more. So do you think the ns ARE should
take control of this situation? And how big is this situation?
Up and down New Zealand eight hundred eighty ten eighty.
You're on the ground you've got the eyes. You see it,
you tell me? Is it a problem? Do New Zealand
Rugby Union have to stand up and actually do something? Palpable?
(25:02):
Oh eight hundred eighty ten eighty your calls coming up
next here at US Talks Love ge snack and but just.
Speaker 10 (25:16):
The right call is your call on eight hundred eighty
eighty sports Talk call on your home of sports US
Talk it be.
Speaker 3 (25:31):
Seven p four sports if on New Stalks B eight
hundred eighty ten eighty. Is there an epidemic from your
experience on the ground at the cold face? Does this
happen frequently alarmingly? Is this increased in frequency over your
(25:54):
time watching the game? And what are your expectations from
NZR around what they have to do here? Are they
doing enough? Is it their responsibility? I'd suggest it is
without strength to the grassroots level, I ain't gonna get
(26:16):
no superstar players. They won't exist because there's no one
to referee the games, there's no one to control the games,
there's no games to be played, so there's no development.
I think this sits squarely in the driver's set of ends.
Are and look, you maybe don't want to sort a
(26:42):
small problem that you could deal with with a little
hammer with a mallet, but sometimes you do have they
dealt with this well. There's a few people here on text.
I run through a couple of them. Shorty say, I
don't like the way they've done this, tell me a
better way to do it. They again think that it's
(27:03):
a small issue, that maybe the hotter for Newer Carpany
have overstated the issue. They've gone too far. I don't
think they have. I think they found an issue and
they're choosing to find a solution to the problem. Some
(27:24):
people are getting burned and they don't like it. I'll
just run through these texts. I'd love to hear from you.
Eight hundred and eighty ten eighty Is it exploding two
ends that are do enough aiden wrights? Is there specifical
action being taken against the offending coach, team club spectators
(27:46):
while it's under the auspices of hot Newer and New
Zealand Rugby. What happens to the two parties i e.
The coach and the referee in the situation. But they
can stop games of rugby. It's hard to stop spectators up,
(28:08):
isn't it. But what they need is the people on
the ground to no longer accept this, so I ad
knites it seems like a dramatic response to take the
game away from the region for the acts of a few.
I don't see the police stopping anyone from driving the Saturday,
because if you drivers have abused them today, I see
your logic. I get your logic. How else do you
(28:31):
change this attitude?
Speaker 1 (28:32):
Though?
Speaker 3 (28:35):
And I would say if a few are causing this issue,
and then the masses have a groundswell of not on
our watch, and the few will no longer be emboldened
by their actions by yelling and shouting and swearing and drinking,
because the greater good, the spectators that actually care about
(28:59):
the future of the game and their kids playing, and
their friends playing, and the strength of the zeal And rugby,
they'll stand up and go, no, we can't do this anymore.
You excuse my French, are a dickhead, Sit down, shut
up and stop wrecking it for everybody else, This to
me is necessary. The same people ruining sport are ruining
(29:21):
society rights another that they can't seem to get their views
across without violence or intimidation. It is so sad, very sad. Indeed,
darcy people showing throw shade at the referees are often
one hundred and forty kg. I mean, who's going to
challenge their behavior? I mean that's a good point, and
big scary people on the sideline having a go, and
(29:43):
who wants to turn around and challenge them? Especially a
guy there has had a few jars, he's drinking way
too much beer on the sideline, starts getting angry. One
person probably not going to change it. Thirty people. Might
you find that these bullies, these drunken yahoos, they ain't
so strong when suddenly everyone's turning on them. Darcy Sideline
(30:10):
Factory is a major problem, highlighted for sure by the
stance taken by Hodophan Carpety Rugby. I've lost count of
the incidents covered to media over the past decade. Time
for a massive cleanup, bring charges against the thugs. Thanks. Gil.
Seems over the top that it might just be the
only way you can solve this, because if it keeps
(30:31):
going forward, like if you believe Canabary Ceo, it doesn't
happen down there. So they're fine, But I'd suggest it
is all over the shop. Someone wants to off soccer
refs get the same deal they probably do. There's an
alarming text and maybe this is what people are worried about.
From Gus Darcy. I used to be a rugby league
(30:52):
reef in christ Church. I've got followed back to my
car after an under thirteen's game with the coach of
the losing team wanted to punch me in the face
because he was so angry that I disallowed his son
a try. I won't be referring any sport ever again.
Now that is tragic. Grants see, I don't agree with
(31:16):
how the hand of the spectator situation. I think they
will see parents getting into altercations with the troublemakers. Simple answer,
issue trespass, notice of the offenders turned up with a
notice and forced and it's a police matter. Don't punish
the genuine supporter because of the idiots. That's fair and well,
but I would suggest the police have got a lot
more pressing matches to deal with than some guy who's
(31:37):
choked back a handful of white tackery, darkyries a white tackery, dakery,
bourbon and coke on the sideline. They don't want to
be dealing with that. I think it can be policed
by the parents and by the people on the side.
I think so anyway, AnyWho, twenty minutes away from eight, Hey, Chris, Hey,
(31:57):
how are you? I'm happy, but I'm sad, if you
know what I mean. It's awful that it happens, but
it's great. Someone's fine, he's still up and go. You know,
bugger this and there's a conversation now.
Speaker 8 (32:07):
I can hear it in your voice. I just thought
i'd do a rugby experience and then experience I had.
I spent twenty years as a football referee. I had
an experienced a couple of years ago in a lower
hut club game and the fullback was getting a bit
vocal and yeah with a lot admit. I was on
the side of the road and we had on the
(32:27):
side of the field and we had some banter. Nothing
bad in my mind, but it was a banter. And
when I finished, a guy came over to me and said, hey,
can I just have a chat to you about what
your chat? I said, yeah, sure, said listen, I'm from
New Zealand rugby and we're trying to put stamp on
the amount of talk and bad vibes that are coming
(32:49):
from the sideline. And I'd just like you to think
about what you just said to that player who was stressed,
who's trying to ruin for his team. He just missed
the ball and that's what started your little interaction, and
just think how they're feeling and how they might bring
that off the field. And the way that he approached
that to me actually sunk in rather than hey you dickhead,
(33:11):
stop what you're doing so New Zealand. This guy, I
don't know whether it was a process or whatever, but
this guy identified himself in New Zummer rugby and highlighted
my behavior, which I took the heart and I've stopped
doing it. So I thought that was pretty good.
Speaker 3 (33:26):
You sound like a pretty level headed guy though, so
he probably.
Speaker 8 (33:30):
There to me, well, I'm pretty good at doing banter,
so I do get caught up in the emotions, so
don't get me wrong. But at that moment, the way
he approached it was fantastic.
Speaker 4 (33:41):
So.
Speaker 8 (33:42):
I was also a soccer referee for twenty six odd
years and he stopped about three years ago, getting a
bit old, both in Canterbury and in South Auckland. South Auckland,
I used to get games that were between different nationalities
and the worst ones that I ran to the car
afterwards with my boots still on. Were games between Pakistanis
(34:05):
and Indians, and I just got off that field. Couldn't understand,
could see the visual way and the force near voices
when I made a decision, and I just got the
hell out of there.
Speaker 11 (34:18):
The other ones were that's kind of race based, and
I remember a bit like, but you've made and there
is a dire I say, a traditional rivalry which we've
seen explode into war over there.
Speaker 3 (34:33):
But I just like, I'm just going out. Yeah I
don't know about that, but you make your points. I'll
just move on.
Speaker 8 (34:38):
Yeah yeah, yeah. So I'm not a racist person at all,
but it was those sort of games that that were
quite challenging, and I recognized it was them, not me,
but I felt unsafe, so I had to get the
hell out of there. The other was female games on Sunday,
and this was in Canterbury, and those ladies were very
very good at making comments behind your back and not
(35:01):
realizing who just said the f and blinding and who
was saying something. They never did anythink to you, but
it quite found a little bit uneasy and not realizing
what was going on being a male on the field
with women in their twenties to their thirties. That's the
other sort of game that made me feel uncomfortable and
just it's interesting to get out of there after the game.
Speaker 3 (35:23):
It's interesting. So what has to happen at the level
though Chris, like, some people are saying, no, it doesn't
happen as much. This is out of statement. Some people
say no, it's huge. Where where does it lie. Who's
the ultimate responsibility with and what they how they make
their decisions and do they have to be extraordinarily harsh
like you touch me, I'll break your kneecap. This is
(35:44):
not literally, this is figuratively around dealing with this.
Speaker 8 (35:50):
Yeah. So so in my real life, I do investigation.
So I do investigations where there's two parties that are
agree with each other, and quite often there's a lot
of emotion in there, and that's the challenge when you're
trying to work out the facts. In this industry, I
think it's the responsibility of those who look at who
engage us to do what we do. So that's discussions
between the referees Association and the parent body, not necessarily
(36:14):
the provisional rugby club. I don't know whether they've done
a piece of work to see exactly what the problem is.
Because I know with the cees that haven't come and
spoken to you, they don't want to enter into that
discussion because in my mind, I don't think it's a
no win. Nobody is going to win, whether it's a player,
somebody on the sideline, someone who's passionate, some older person,
(36:37):
or the owners of the DIC. He's not going to
be a winner in this one. It's hard.
Speaker 3 (36:45):
It is hard, but Chris, I think that stop. Yeah,
but the key thing here and thanks for your tour.
We got Matt pains around the corner that the key
thing here is that there may not be a winner.
You make good points, oh, but there's going to be
a loser or right, that loser is New Zealand Rugby.
They stand to lose the most. Therefore they should drive
(37:09):
responsibility around solving this issue. They stand to lose the most.
It's up to them to solve this problem. It's quarter
away Matt Payne supercars coming up next here on NEWSTALKSB.
This news Dog's e bes eleven minutes away from eight o'clock.
(37:31):
Marker's slash up around the corner right now, we're going
to talk supercars. That's announced yesterday that there are supercar
events coming back on back in Topaul and in April
next year. We're talking now to third place, third place
holder currently the Supercars Championship. Matt payin good evening.
Speaker 4 (37:51):
How are we very good?
Speaker 3 (37:53):
Very good? Now that I know there's one Halla Halla
double shot coming up next year. It's it's official supercars
are going to be in Topaul. A week later they're
going to be in christ Church. Is a key. We lad.
You must be beaming, Matt.
Speaker 6 (38:07):
It's bloody good too. It's bloody good to get two
rounds here, you know. I think it was great. I
thought it was awesome when Talpo.
Speaker 3 (38:14):
Was announced, but it's I think it's even better now than.
Speaker 6 (38:17):
The two rounds. So you know, the Kiwi crowd's got
an opportunity to roll up to Toepaul for the North
Island round and then finish it off with the with
the South Island round. It's pretty cool.
Speaker 3 (38:29):
What do you know about the little Perna? Have you
spent much time peeling around there? Matt?
Speaker 7 (38:34):
None?
Speaker 6 (38:34):
Nothing, never turned the lap round?
Speaker 3 (38:36):
You are kidding men.
Speaker 6 (38:39):
It's pretty strange really, but I think it's going to
be a bit of a bit of the same story
for everyone. So I think for sure there'll be people
coming over and doing some laps in some other cars,
and I think I'll definitely take that opportunity. And yeah,
I think it's going to be a I think it's going.
Speaker 4 (38:55):
To be a great week indo racing that we yet hope.
Speaker 3 (38:57):
So I'd say Andre and Ryan have probably had a
better time down there around that, so he might be
looking at your shoulder at them, bro.
Speaker 6 (39:04):
Yeah, I think they have turned a few well apps
than anyone else around here, so they've probably got the advantage.
Speaker 3 (39:10):
I can't quite get over the fact that the Australians
are having a double header in New Zealand with the
pain that excuse the pun that we've inflicted on them
in supercars over the last decade or so. I thought
it'd be sick to the back teeth. And Key has
had enough of all the ones over there. Now there's
a second wave coming through this. This is strange. Are
(39:30):
they showing to some kind of man love or something? Back?
Speaker 4 (39:34):
Oh, it's it's certainly, it's certainly cool.
Speaker 6 (39:37):
Like it's it's definitely when the when the when the
topor round comes around and especially this year that the
Kiwi fans just really get behind you and it's pretty special.
So it's it's definitely a cool weekend to be a
part of and from for me my first experience that
that was last year, and and I'll never forget how
(39:57):
many Kiwi fans there and what it truly meant to
them to have supercars back in New Zealand. And now
that we've got a double header, I think it's I
think it's going to be even more exciting, twice as
much action, and it's certainly certainly very very special for
New Zealand motorsport, and I think even even supercars as
a whole.
Speaker 3 (40:17):
You can register interest now to get tickets, and I
reckon people should be beating the door down because I
know what cantabs are like, that's where I'm from. When
I know what they think about motorsport. It's going to
be faresome, isn't it.
Speaker 6 (40:28):
It's it's going to be awesome. I think the crowd's
really going to turn it on and it's going to
be There's been some really good racing this year. I
think we've we've shown that and I think it's going
to be expected here at real Bo.
Speaker 3 (40:42):
And hopefully you can carry on the form even though
we've got half a season and some more before you
get back up. You're showing the moment and your grave
racing pen right car. You had a great weekend last
weekend and eight and a couple of third year. What
are you sitting in the championship right now? Third in
the championship? This is fantastic.
Speaker 6 (40:59):
Yeah, it's been. It's been going really well, especially the
last few weekends. We've been the tracks that we haven't
I haven't previously had success out in the past, so
it's nice to really turn that around and and have.
Speaker 7 (41:14):
Some really good results and.
Speaker 6 (41:15):
Bag some some big points before we get into the
back half of the season just to just to lock
in that spot in the finals. So it's definitely it's
definitely been really good. I'm really looking forward to the
to the rest of the year. I think there's some
awesome tracks coming up that you know, we have had
success at, so it's going to be pretty exciting rolling
out to there and see what we got.
Speaker 1 (41:36):
You no need for the DMO. We've got the breakdown
on Sports Talk cool wait News Talk said.
Speaker 3 (41:46):
Seven minutes to eight Sports Talk Era on News Talk
is z B. I'm Darcy new Sporting Weather, approaching Marcus
Slush around the corner. Jeez, you think the referees get abused?
Come sit in this seat and read the text lines.
(42:13):
Oh yeah, cowards, Come on, meet me outside the building.
Whatever we chat, it's this News Talks EB. I'm Darcy
waller Grave. Thanks very much for joining us over the
last hour of Sports Talk. Back again tomorrow from seven
to eight. Of course he'll Sport Break between seven and
nine a m. Saturday on News Talks EDB. Been crazy
(42:34):
a couple of days, dodging and weaving, if you will,
around the issues we have at a refereeing level and
the reaction they get from fans who don't understand a
pretty basic concept. The referee runs the show. It's their show.
They are the boss. They are the final judge, jury,
(42:55):
and execution. It you don't like it, don't watch it,
just leave, don't turn up, get in the c seyah.
Speaker 1 (43:16):
For more from Sports Talk, listen live to News Talks
it B from seven pm weekdays, or follow the podcast
on iHeartRadio
You're listening to the Sports Talk podcast with Dancy Waldegrave
from News Talk zed B.
Speaker 2 (00:42):
H O.
Speaker 3 (00:57):
Here we are radio today. I had to fight hited
the Placey Ellen for the headphones, Hughes, forgive them to me. Plainly,
she won the fight. That's why I'm so late. I'm
beaten and bruised by the award winning drive host. Now
I had it coming. Hello, I'm Darcy Watergrove. Seven minutes
(01:21):
after seven. It is on our Thursday night, June twenty six,
twenty twenty five. This is Sports Talk. We talk sport
from now through until eight o'clock tonight. We're going to
talk more rugby, more misbehavior, more sanctions, more drama at
a grassroots level in rugby union here and now t
(01:42):
and of course theys. We know it is our national game.
This is important. Water the dirt flowers last for you. Sorry,
listen to Williams to steal that line. But it's true.
Got to look after this level to keep the top running. Well.
(02:02):
Not this level. Is this level is refereeing at the
grassroots because without the rest, we don't got a game none.
You understand now the referees are getting abused. If the
referees are getting jostled, if the referee, if the referees
get sick of this, there's no more rugby. And this
happened last night when Corey Kennett joined us, the head
(02:24):
of Hotopania Carpety Rugby. So that right, that's it. We're
stopping rugby this weekend. We told you once don't behave
like Dix and if you do, we're going to stop rugby.
And they did. It's been quite a bounce back after that.
We're going to cover that off today. We and to
take more of your cause I've got a angle or
two that I'd like to serve at you to see
(02:46):
what we've got back. And look, I promise we're going
to talk to Matt Pain yesterday and it didn't happen.
That's okay. We'll roll with Matt tonight for the supercar
fans out there, But initially on the program we have
got well, we've got a couple of names for you
to look through what's happened over the last twenty four hours.
(03:09):
Will be joined by Brian Dickinson. First, he runs College
Sport in Wellington. Around that decision, what happened, what occurred
to the best of his knowledge, and then we'll go
to in Dallason at Wellington Referees and find out what
the effect this is having on him and his representatives
and on his volunteers, and then we'll take your call.
(03:32):
So like one hundred and eighty ten eighty, that, my friend,
is what we plan. So that is what we're going
to do. But first.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
Sport today and in sport today, nothing to see here,
nothing at all, despite the decisions from hood. If a
company rugby CEO that referee abuse from the sidelines is
an epidemic in New Zealand, it isn't in Canterbury at least,
says the CEO.
Speaker 3 (04:03):
Tony Snail.
Speaker 4 (04:04):
We get an incident once a year that we need
to deal with.
Speaker 5 (04:07):
We're talking to someone to crack at the referee verbally,
it's far from an epidemic inside Canterbury.
Speaker 3 (04:12):
Okay, Quevy cyclist Lewis Smala has scored himself a pro
cycle contract. I have been promoted from Gripama if the
Jay's development team. He's a chance for a grind to
a spot with difficult like thirty old people trying to
jam into eight rides. So be it so his lure
or the lure of the Olympic Games. Just like it
(04:35):
isn't as strong as you'd think.
Speaker 1 (04:37):
It's not like a big goal of mine. From a
lot of sports. The pinnacle is the Olympics. For cycling,
it's kind of just like a bonus of then.
Speaker 3 (04:43):
But yeah, it'd be super special to represent the country
at the Olympics.
Speaker 6 (04:47):
Right now, I'm just focusing for the on the road
cycling scene in Europe.
Speaker 3 (04:51):
I want to do the tour of France and the
tour to everything else and make the big bucks. Then
I might try and pick up a medal. Good on you.
Harkypyw Zealand is hailing the means that black sticks culture
as being instrumental in their success, even though they've hardly
played over the last year. But when they do get
this sticks out, they win. Acting chief executive.
Speaker 7 (05:12):
Kim Mapleston, they have an incredibly strong team culture and
they work on that really, really hard even when they're
not together.
Speaker 1 (05:18):
So even though the team may not be physically together
every week, they connect a lot through all the digital
platforms that we.
Speaker 3 (05:24):
All use these days. And for you hoop fans out there,
the number one pick in the NBA draft is he
young and nearly as young as Lebron James when he
was the number one pick way back when the eighteen
year old main product Cooper Bag understands the pressure though,
but he thinks he knows the steps through.
Speaker 8 (05:43):
My way that I deal with pressure and I deal
with expectations.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
Is just using the people around me. Is you know,
using my parents, using my brothers, using my friends from
back home.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
It's been with me every step of the way, and.
Speaker 7 (05:52):
That's my supports and that's how I deal with things
like that. So you know, just trying to breathe is
definitely not easy, but it's something you got to deal with.
Speaker 4 (05:58):
And that's sport today.
Speaker 9 (06:01):
Eleven minutes after seven, let's get amongst the rugby dramas
around the referee abuse from the soiline which kicked off,
yes the day out of a couple of weeks back,
but it was put into place, the hammer came down,
the trigger was pulled and Hotto for our carpety Rugby decided.
Speaker 3 (06:18):
To close the shop, if you will this weekend after
sideline abuse. We're going to go now to the College
Sport Wellington executive director Brian Dickinson to take a look
at this good evening. Brian, welcome, into the program. You,
of course, are the executive director of College Sport, Wellington.
(06:41):
You've issued a release earlier today saying you stand in
full support of the referees with the recent decision made
by hot Fur Company Rugby Football Union to defer all
those rugby matches. So in support of this decision, the
secondary schools on the Company Coast have collectively agreed to
defer their schedule rugby fixtures as well. So is this
(07:03):
on your watch? Is this something they sided through you
or something they kind of had to do because of
what happened up at the Company Coast game.
Speaker 7 (07:13):
Yeah, I mean, ultimately the schools have made that decision.
We agree with it and support that decision. But it's
always good to get to a position where the schools
are making the decisions and taking on themselves. But no,
that was certainly sitting with the schools.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
So why just the Kapiti Coast area and Amana College
were a part of this, But why just that particular region?
How many schools does this actually affect? Brian?
Speaker 7 (07:36):
Yeah, that was the bit that we have been grappling
with today. So our competition, we've got forty two secondary
schools in our region covering Wellington and Horror Funeral Cavity,
and we do have a couple of schools that come
into our competition as well, and really trying to figure
out how do we support the referees and Horroofenaic Cavity's decision,
(07:59):
but drawing a circle around you know, what what is
if he can what's not. So we feel that's the
right with We feel like it's fallen in the right
place with the Horror fenwic Kempety school's supporting the decision
College obviously because it was involved the incident on the weekend,
but the other secondary school sport will go ahead of
(08:20):
Rugby will go ahead on the weekend.
Speaker 3 (08:21):
What engagement have you had with Wellington Rugby around this,
because plainly you're looking at college sport only you can't
go any further. Do you need their backing? Do you
need ends ours backing to make a call like this, Brian.
Speaker 7 (08:37):
No, we don't need specifically their backing, but certainly we've
been keeping Welling to Rugby in the loop.
Speaker 3 (08:42):
I mean even even they were affected.
Speaker 7 (08:44):
Where there's junior Horror Fenway Cavity teams that they're playing
a combined regional competition. Now those clubs on the coast.
Junior clubs made the call to stand their teams down
this weekend, so essentially there was secondary schools on the
coast have made the same decision.
Speaker 3 (09:01):
Do they still have any effects long term? Because the
whole idea behind what if you know a carpet you
have been doing to try and put a line under
this end bolting, and we're not going to do this anymore,
and this is maybe the only way we can actually
shake people out of their funk to listen to us.
Do you think this will work? Is this going to
have any effect? Hopefully?
Speaker 7 (09:21):
I'm sure everyone Corey included hopes that this is one off.
It sends the right signal to be able to pull
leads on the sidelines. Can't guarantee that, but hopefully that
is the case.
Speaker 3 (09:32):
I suppose it comes down to when you look at
all these school kids, well, how many school kids are
going to be affected over this weekend and the last
weekend before the holidays a couple of hundred ie. Presumingly
they'll be upset, but their parents and caregivers will be going, hey,
hold on, this is not right, and maybe that pushes
them into action sidelines and they go no, We're not
going to put up with us anymore. I mean, that's
(09:53):
the idea, isn't it.
Speaker 4 (09:54):
It is.
Speaker 7 (09:55):
I've mean across those Catholic schools and now we've got
six secondary school teams that had games this schedule this weekend.
I'm conscious that some of those teams, for one reason,
they haven't acually play for the last two or three
weeks because of weather and what not. So this is
a pretty bitter pill to swallow for some of those
schools or teams that weren't involved in this, that essentially
(10:15):
won't have a game for a month or so until
we come back into term three. This is a small
number of spectators that are not behaving in the proper way.
We don't want to cast all spectors. Secondators on the
sideline are acting untoward. But yeah, yeah, we've got to
just see in the right signals.
Speaker 3 (10:34):
You say, so, you say spectators, Brian. From from what
I can gather, it was a coaching staff, the referees
as opposed to sideline spectators. It's all very muddled and
foggy because none of us are there. But to the
best of your knowledge, what actually occurred there.
Speaker 7 (10:51):
Yeah, I'll see praying out in two shoes, and one
thing I should say is horror find or copy. Because
this game happened in there in their PU area, they
take the lead. It's their judicial process. We're here to
support that exactly like we words if this had happened
and way from Rugby's region. So two things happen on
the weekend within the game. One is around the sideline behavior,
(11:12):
poor language and getting stuck into the referee, and the
other one is around an instant between the coach and
the referee. If you separate the two things out the
coach referee side of things, that'll go through a hearing
with horror capity. That hearing hasn't been held yet, and
so we'll respect that process and both sides can put
their put in the case forward and horror feneralickevity can
(11:33):
work their way through it. As far as just the
straight sideline behavior, that's essentially the principal reason why those
those games have been called off this weekend.
Speaker 3 (11:43):
I think was there like how many people were engaged
in that and was it It didn't result in people
punching or throng. It was basically just just foul language
abuse from the sideline, And was this was that a
couple of people at group. What was the deal then?
Speaker 7 (11:56):
Yeah, correct, I mean I don't think it was it
was hundreds of It certainly wasn't hundreds of people. That
was scattering of people would probably be the best way
to describe it. So no, it wasn't. It wasn't and
all in and certainly the other incident is confined to
just the coach and the referee and whatnot.
Speaker 3 (12:15):
What's the reaction been from the company, Coast teams and
from Manor College themselves. Have they come back to you
with anything? Are they taking this well?
Speaker 7 (12:26):
Yeah, I mean on the coast, I don't know if
you've seen in the social media there's that ground sask for.
Certainly the clubs are on board with it and the
schools are supporting it as well. So what again, it
was the incision to call us off. We agree with it.
We think that's the right outcome. But those the schools
are fully on board.
Speaker 3 (12:45):
Talking with Corey Kenna did yesterday saying hey, go this
is a problem all over New Zealand. This is not
just around our district or area. Do you back that up?
This is actually a general issue on the ground right
across the mountain.
Speaker 7 (13:00):
I think sidelent behavior is an issue as across all sports.
To be honest, Rugby certainly has it's for a share
of it. I wouldn't say it has a monopoly on it.
Certainly standards could be improved. I don't want to overstate it.
Speaker 3 (13:13):
Well.
Speaker 7 (13:13):
I mean we certainly have great sideline behavior as well.
We just have to keep dealing with specific issues they
as they arise, and I mean to Corey's point, we
appreciate that they've had issues within club fixtures and it
just happened that this incident on the weekend happened to
involve schools. So yeah, that's what's triggered this decision.
Speaker 3 (13:34):
So college sport Wellington, I have no coveredy rugby union.
Should this be actually in their court? Should New Zealand
Rugby actually be showing some form of leadership here and
maybe issuing their own edits as to what's acceptable and
what's not because this is their game, surely they should
be ruling not necessary than I in first but going hey,
(13:54):
we're going to do this, it's worked behave. Is that
too much to ask that they take the need?
Speaker 4 (14:00):
I think they are leading.
Speaker 7 (14:02):
We cover all sports in the Wellington Secondary School space
look at the judicial process across the various sports. I
do believes on rugby has got the most robust and
well organized judicial process and they work their way through it.
Could they be tougher on behavior? I guess we probably
all could. I mean that's probably a conversation, but I
(14:23):
mean certainly on rugby's coming out today in support of
the decision, you know, I mean ultimately it boils right
down to club, school and and individual responsibilities as well.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
To get the riffs call.
Speaker 8 (14:34):
You make the call on.
Speaker 1 (14:37):
Sports Talk on your home of Sports News.
Speaker 3 (14:40):
Talks and there it is part one of the two
part story around the referring dramas that we've had in Dallas.
Is going to join us shortly Wellington rugby referees at
BOSS as we look into this issue and just joining
us on the program. Then, was Brian Dickinson, head of
(15:03):
College Sport Wellington kind of clarify the issue here? But
I suppose right at the point at end, other referees
they're the ones that take this stick. They're the ones
that to deal with this for nothing, well they might
do they get a whistle, maybe a hat and a
T shirt or just endless grief. Why would you sort
(15:24):
of talk about that. We're joined now by in Dallas
in what do you make of this?
Speaker 5 (15:32):
Well, we obviously totally support horror and it's horrible to
think that it's come to this and they've had the
web all to make this massive decision because it affects
a lot of people, a lot of people who have
trained and organized and managed players, etc. And families supporting
it are all going to miss out. And that's hugely
(15:53):
just supporting in itself. But I think, you know, particularly
with the issues that they've had up there this year,
more than ever.
Speaker 4 (16:01):
Somewhere along the line, you've got to draw a line
in the sand.
Speaker 5 (16:04):
And to do this, I think it's fantastic and we
support them totally in that regard.
Speaker 3 (16:08):
You say issues up there, as historically they've had a
bad time of sideline referee abuse. Is this something that's
quite common.
Speaker 4 (16:17):
To the area or now?
Speaker 5 (16:19):
I don't think they are any different than anywhere else really,
I mean, I would imagine everywhere has had the issues
over over time, just that unfortunately for them, this year
is really highlighted and they've had a couple of seemingly
horrendous issues earlier on where people have been threatened and
when it gets to that level, that's just totally unacceptable
(16:41):
and someone's going to do something. So to see that
actually up a province is happy to get behind their
referee association and to make this kind of a step
is terrific because protecting people who are out in the
middle or even aar on the sideline or any other
official any other sport, they've got to be protected and
they've got to be able to enjoy the sport that
(17:01):
they enjoy as much as people playing it. And if
people on the sideline are not allowing that, well, it's
a horrible scenario.
Speaker 3 (17:09):
Do you think let's all have an effect that we
will notice as far as people responding from the sidelining, Hey,
you're actually wrecking our weekend now, you guys, you've got
to stop. Does this need to occur to maybe create
that groundswell of rejection amongst the good spectators to stop
this occurring.
Speaker 5 (17:29):
Yeah, I totally agree with it in that regard, because
we can't just keep paying lip service to this kind
of thing, and people very quickly forget the little little
things we may do to try and stop this, you know,
banning someone from being on the sideline, which can you
or can't you do that?
Speaker 4 (17:46):
People just turn up anyway.
Speaker 5 (17:47):
So for a whole association and province to stand up
and make this very very public is a great start
because we're all in this together and everyone's got to
be joining together to stop it. And the more that
other members that public feel the emboldened to say something,
to turn.
Speaker 4 (18:05):
Around and go lock, hey, do you want to happen?
And again, what happened last weekend? We had no rugby
at all. Just cut it out.
Speaker 5 (18:11):
The more people are in bold and to stand up
and stop that kind of thing, the better it's got
to be.
Speaker 4 (18:16):
But so something of this level is gold. I believe in.
Speaker 3 (18:21):
Your role as the one of the Rugby Referees Association chairman,
do you see an effect on the amount of young
referees who want to get into the sport but are
put off by such actions on the sidelind Does this
have a palpable effect on your ability to recruit people
into the role.
Speaker 4 (18:41):
I'm sure it does.
Speaker 5 (18:42):
We've got no exact data around that, but where we
find it is around retaining referees. We lose referees, not
on a regular basis, but now and again, and it
still happened this year as well. Where referees have said
is because of the abuse, they're stepping away, and I'm
sure it does make it harder for us to actually
(19:05):
recruit as well. People will hear that sitting on the
sideline if they're players themselves, and that's where we'd love
to get more referees from.
Speaker 4 (19:12):
But if they know what goes on and go like,
I would never do that. I don't want to be
involved with that.
Speaker 5 (19:17):
Or have to suffer that kind of behavior. Well, it
certainly does impact on us. And we're as short of
referees this year as we have ever been.
Speaker 3 (19:25):
You say, as short as what are we looking at here?
The potential for games just not to go ahead because
there are no officials.
Speaker 4 (19:33):
In That's absolutely correct.
Speaker 5 (19:35):
There's a lot of games, not every weekend, but a
lot of weekends where we just cannot supply referees because
our numbers are so short, and those games only go
ahead if there's perhaps someone who's had an associate referee
course that they've done and able to referee contested scrums.
Speaker 4 (19:51):
The odd parent might get involved at lower levels, but I.
Speaker 5 (19:55):
Know and I'm aware of a lot of them saying, look,
we just don't want to do this anymore. We get
such a hard time. So yes, a tough one and as.
Speaker 3 (20:04):
Far as he's in Rubia concerned that because this is
their game, they are the overlords, they run it all.
Are you satisfied with what they provide as far as
input to stopping this kind of behavior? Are they effective
in that role?
Speaker 5 (20:21):
I don't think they're do as much overtly as they
could do. They're always supportive, but I think you know,
there comes a time when.
Speaker 4 (20:29):
They need to lead a lot of it.
Speaker 5 (20:31):
You know, they are the overriding of the game and
this is a big issue. Referee numbers right throughout New
Zealand are down and if they can lead it and
drive that down through the provincial unions, well then that's
just got to be a good thing. So yeah, I'd
like to see some more avert leadership from them in
that regard.
Speaker 1 (20:50):
You hear it from the biggest names and sports and men.
Speaker 10 (20:53):
Have your sale always eighty eighty Sports Talk or more
on your home of sports news Talks Aye six.
Speaker 3 (21:01):
This is Sports Talk. It was in Dallas, Wellington rugby
referee boss has thought someone's gone down over the last
of twenty four hours in Rugby. A few points out
of those last two conversations, I'd like to expand on
with of course your involvement. I was going to say help,
but I really need help with your assistance, with your engagement.
(21:23):
Oh eight hundred eighty ten eighty. You've got the ability
to talk back talk at so please do two things.
There's in the newsroom today. There's been a lot of conversations,
had a lot of phone calls made to various CEOs
of various pus up and down the country to get
(21:45):
people to talk on tape to express their opinions and
with the views of their pu anyway around. What's happening
here And one of the biggest questions coming from the
reporters in this building is this an epidemic. This is
what the CEO of a company ted yesterday. It's an
(22:05):
epidemic referee abuse in this country. Now, as you heard
in Sport today, the CEO off Canterbury said was not
we're fine one or two year, that's about it. We're sweet,
it doesn't happen here. A lot of the other CEOs
didn't want to come on in. We want to talk
about it. We talked yesterday about it's being brushed under
(22:26):
the carpet, brushed under the rug and Corey cannet, we've
got someone who's wanting to stand up and go, well, no,
it is an issue and we can't deal with it anymore,
so we're going to do something. So I can't speak
for these CEOs. I don't know what happens around the
grounds on a weekly basis in rugby. And Corey says
it's an issue, and then some of these people said, no,
(22:47):
it isn't. But don't know who to believe nown even
if we can believe in the people on the ground
right although we know there's three sides to every story,
my side, your side, and the truth sits somewhere in between.
But from your experience, is this an epidemic? Is this
a genuine problem in you seeling rugby? And I'm going
(23:07):
from not maybe not rip a rugby, but up to
seeing your rugby in your experience as a player, as
a volunteer, as a parent, as a guardian. What do
you see at the games? What do you hear at
the games? I want to hear from people at the
bottom of the country, at the top of the country,
to the west and to the east. Is this an epidemic.
(23:30):
Is there a problem with abuse from the sideline directed
at referees? That's question one. If you're a referee, I'd
love to hear from you what are you experience maybe
how you get rid of it as well? Second thing,
and this is something I've been a bit hod on recently.
(23:50):
This is the sole responsibility of z ARE, isn't it.
What should they be doing? And we just heard them
from Ian Dallas saying, well, they kind of need to
do more. And this is like, I don't think people
want to roundly point a finger at in z ARE.
It's a small community. I don't want to upset the overlords,
now do they? But if it takes a small union
(24:14):
to actually do something really should be getting done by
the national body, you start asking questions and scratching your head,
don't you Like Our first guest did say that they
do a good job. Their judicial process is fantastic. This
is Brian Dickinson. But you get the feeling they could
(24:36):
do more. So do you think the ns ARE should
take control of this situation? And how big is this situation?
Up and down New Zealand eight hundred eighty ten eighty.
You're on the ground you've got the eyes. You see it,
you tell me? Is it a problem? Do New Zealand
Rugby Union have to stand up and actually do something? Palpable?
(25:02):
Oh eight hundred eighty ten eighty your calls coming up
next here at US Talks Love ge snack and but just.
Speaker 10 (25:16):
The right call is your call on eight hundred eighty
eighty sports Talk call on your home of sports US
Talk it be.
Speaker 3 (25:31):
Seven p four sports if on New Stalks B eight
hundred eighty ten eighty. Is there an epidemic from your
experience on the ground at the cold face? Does this
happen frequently alarmingly? Is this increased in frequency over your
(25:54):
time watching the game? And what are your expectations from
NZR around what they have to do here? Are they
doing enough? Is it their responsibility? I'd suggest it is
without strength to the grassroots level, I ain't gonna get
(26:16):
no superstar players. They won't exist because there's no one
to referee the games, there's no one to control the games,
there's no games to be played, so there's no development.
I think this sits squarely in the driver's set of ends.
Are and look, you maybe don't want to sort a
(26:42):
small problem that you could deal with with a little
hammer with a mallet, but sometimes you do have they
dealt with this well. There's a few people here on text.
I run through a couple of them. Shorty say, I
don't like the way they've done this, tell me a
better way to do it. They again think that it's
(27:03):
a small issue, that maybe the hotter for Newer Carpany
have overstated the issue. They've gone too far. I don't
think they have. I think they found an issue and
they're choosing to find a solution to the problem. Some
(27:24):
people are getting burned and they don't like it. I'll
just run through these texts. I'd love to hear from you.
Eight hundred and eighty ten eighty Is it exploding two
ends that are do enough aiden wrights? Is there specifical
action being taken against the offending coach, team club spectators
(27:46):
while it's under the auspices of hot Newer and New
Zealand Rugby. What happens to the two parties i e.
The coach and the referee in the situation. But they
can stop games of rugby. It's hard to stop spectators up,
(28:08):
isn't it. But what they need is the people on
the ground to no longer accept this, so I ad
knites it seems like a dramatic response to take the
game away from the region for the acts of a few.
I don't see the police stopping anyone from driving the Saturday,
because if you drivers have abused them today, I see
your logic. I get your logic. How else do you
(28:31):
change this attitude?
Speaker 1 (28:32):
Though?
Speaker 3 (28:35):
And I would say if a few are causing this issue,
and then the masses have a groundswell of not on
our watch, and the few will no longer be emboldened
by their actions by yelling and shouting and swearing and drinking,
because the greater good, the spectators that actually care about
(28:59):
the future of the game and their kids playing, and
their friends playing, and the strength of the zeal And rugby,
they'll stand up and go, no, we can't do this anymore.
You excuse my French, are a dickhead, Sit down, shut
up and stop wrecking it for everybody else, This to
me is necessary. The same people ruining sport are ruining
(29:21):
society rights another that they can't seem to get their views
across without violence or intimidation. It is so sad, very sad. Indeed,
darcy people showing throw shade at the referees are often
one hundred and forty kg. I mean, who's going to
challenge their behavior? I mean that's a good point, and
big scary people on the sideline having a go, and
(29:43):
who wants to turn around and challenge them? Especially a
guy there has had a few jars, he's drinking way
too much beer on the sideline, starts getting angry. One
person probably not going to change it. Thirty people. Might
you find that these bullies, these drunken yahoos, they ain't
so strong when suddenly everyone's turning on them. Darcy Sideline
(30:10):
Factory is a major problem, highlighted for sure by the
stance taken by Hodophan Carpety Rugby. I've lost count of
the incidents covered to media over the past decade. Time
for a massive cleanup, bring charges against the thugs. Thanks. Gil.
Seems over the top that it might just be the
only way you can solve this, because if it keeps
(30:31):
going forward, like if you believe Canabary Ceo, it doesn't
happen down there. So they're fine, But I'd suggest it
is all over the shop. Someone wants to off soccer
refs get the same deal they probably do. There's an
alarming text and maybe this is what people are worried about.
From Gus Darcy. I used to be a rugby league
(30:52):
reef in christ Church. I've got followed back to my
car after an under thirteen's game with the coach of
the losing team wanted to punch me in the face
because he was so angry that I disallowed his son
a try. I won't be referring any sport ever again.
Now that is tragic. Grants see, I don't agree with
(31:16):
how the hand of the spectator situation. I think they
will see parents getting into altercations with the troublemakers. Simple answer,
issue trespass, notice of the offenders turned up with a
notice and forced and it's a police matter. Don't punish
the genuine supporter because of the idiots. That's fair and well,
but I would suggest the police have got a lot
more pressing matches to deal with than some guy who's
(31:37):
choked back a handful of white tackery, darkyries a white tackery, dakery,
bourbon and coke on the sideline. They don't want to
be dealing with that. I think it can be policed
by the parents and by the people on the side.
I think so anyway, AnyWho, twenty minutes away from eight, Hey, Chris, Hey,
(31:57):
how are you? I'm happy, but I'm sad, if you
know what I mean. It's awful that it happens, but
it's great. Someone's fine, he's still up and go. You know,
bugger this and there's a conversation now.
Speaker 8 (32:07):
I can hear it in your voice. I just thought
i'd do a rugby experience and then experience I had.
I spent twenty years as a football referee. I had
an experienced a couple of years ago in a lower
hut club game and the fullback was getting a bit
vocal and yeah with a lot admit. I was on
the side of the road and we had on the
(32:27):
side of the field and we had some banter. Nothing
bad in my mind, but it was a banter. And
when I finished, a guy came over to me and said, hey,
can I just have a chat to you about what
your chat? I said, yeah, sure, said listen, I'm from
New Zealand rugby and we're trying to put stamp on
the amount of talk and bad vibes that are coming
(32:49):
from the sideline. And I'd just like you to think
about what you just said to that player who was stressed,
who's trying to ruin for his team. He just missed
the ball and that's what started your little interaction, and
just think how they're feeling and how they might bring
that off the field. And the way that he approached
that to me actually sunk in rather than hey you dickhead,
(33:11):
stop what you're doing so New Zealand. This guy, I
don't know whether it was a process or whatever, but
this guy identified himself in New Zummer rugby and highlighted
my behavior, which I took the heart and I've stopped
doing it. So I thought that was pretty good.
Speaker 3 (33:26):
You sound like a pretty level headed guy though, so
he probably.
Speaker 8 (33:30):
There to me, well, I'm pretty good at doing banter,
so I do get caught up in the emotions, so
don't get me wrong. But at that moment, the way
he approached it was fantastic.
Speaker 4 (33:41):
So.
Speaker 8 (33:42):
I was also a soccer referee for twenty six odd
years and he stopped about three years ago, getting a
bit old, both in Canterbury and in South Auckland. South Auckland,
I used to get games that were between different nationalities
and the worst ones that I ran to the car
afterwards with my boots still on. Were games between Pakistanis
(34:05):
and Indians, and I just got off that field. Couldn't understand,
could see the visual way and the force near voices
when I made a decision, and I just got the
hell out of there.
Speaker 11 (34:18):
The other ones were that's kind of race based, and
I remember a bit like, but you've made and there
is a dire I say, a traditional rivalry which we've
seen explode into war over there.
Speaker 3 (34:33):
But I just like, I'm just going out. Yeah I
don't know about that, but you make your points. I'll
just move on.
Speaker 8 (34:38):
Yeah yeah, yeah. So I'm not a racist person at all,
but it was those sort of games that that were
quite challenging, and I recognized it was them, not me,
but I felt unsafe, so I had to get the
hell out of there. The other was female games on Sunday,
and this was in Canterbury, and those ladies were very
very good at making comments behind your back and not
(35:01):
realizing who just said the f and blinding and who
was saying something. They never did anythink to you, but
it quite found a little bit uneasy and not realizing
what was going on being a male on the field
with women in their twenties to their thirties. That's the
other sort of game that made me feel uncomfortable and
just it's interesting to get out of there after the game.
Speaker 3 (35:23):
It's interesting. So what has to happen at the level
though Chris, like, some people are saying, no, it doesn't
happen as much. This is out of statement. Some people
say no, it's huge. Where where does it lie. Who's
the ultimate responsibility with and what they how they make
their decisions and do they have to be extraordinarily harsh
like you touch me, I'll break your kneecap. This is
(35:44):
not literally, this is figuratively around dealing with this.
Speaker 8 (35:50):
Yeah. So so in my real life, I do investigation.
So I do investigations where there's two parties that are
agree with each other, and quite often there's a lot
of emotion in there, and that's the challenge when you're
trying to work out the facts. In this industry, I
think it's the responsibility of those who look at who
engage us to do what we do. So that's discussions
between the referees Association and the parent body, not necessarily
(36:14):
the provisional rugby club. I don't know whether they've done
a piece of work to see exactly what the problem is.
Because I know with the cees that haven't come and
spoken to you, they don't want to enter into that
discussion because in my mind, I don't think it's a
no win. Nobody is going to win, whether it's a player,
somebody on the sideline, someone who's passionate, some older person,
(36:37):
or the owners of the DIC. He's not going to
be a winner in this one. It's hard.
Speaker 3 (36:45):
It is hard, but Chris, I think that stop. Yeah,
but the key thing here and thanks for your tour.
We got Matt pains around the corner that the key
thing here is that there may not be a winner.
You make good points, oh, but there's going to be
a loser or right, that loser is New Zealand Rugby.
They stand to lose the most. Therefore they should drive
(37:09):
responsibility around solving this issue. They stand to lose the most.
It's up to them to solve this problem. It's quarter
away Matt Payne supercars coming up next here on NEWSTALKSB.
This news Dog's e bes eleven minutes away from eight o'clock.
(37:31):
Marker's slash up around the corner right now, we're going
to talk supercars. That's announced yesterday that there are supercar
events coming back on back in Topaul and in April
next year. We're talking now to third place, third place
holder currently the Supercars Championship. Matt payin good evening.
Speaker 4 (37:51):
How are we very good?
Speaker 3 (37:53):
Very good? Now that I know there's one Halla Halla
double shot coming up next year. It's it's official supercars
are going to be in Topaul. A week later they're
going to be in christ Church. Is a key. We lad.
You must be beaming, Matt.
Speaker 6 (38:07):
It's bloody good too. It's bloody good to get two
rounds here, you know. I think it was great. I
thought it was awesome when Talpo.
Speaker 3 (38:14):
Was announced, but it's I think it's even better now than.
Speaker 6 (38:17):
The two rounds. So you know, the Kiwi crowd's got
an opportunity to roll up to Toepaul for the North
Island round and then finish it off with the with
the South Island round. It's pretty cool.
Speaker 3 (38:29):
What do you know about the little Perna? Have you
spent much time peeling around there? Matt?
Speaker 7 (38:34):
None?
Speaker 6 (38:34):
Nothing, never turned the lap round?
Speaker 3 (38:36):
You are kidding men.
Speaker 6 (38:39):
It's pretty strange really, but I think it's going to
be a bit of a bit of the same story
for everyone. So I think for sure there'll be people
coming over and doing some laps in some other cars,
and I think I'll definitely take that opportunity. And yeah,
I think it's going to be a I think it's going.
Speaker 4 (38:55):
To be a great week indo racing that we yet hope.
Speaker 3 (38:57):
So I'd say Andre and Ryan have probably had a
better time down there around that, so he might be
looking at your shoulder at them, bro.
Speaker 6 (39:04):
Yeah, I think they have turned a few well apps
than anyone else around here, so they've probably got the advantage.
Speaker 3 (39:10):
I can't quite get over the fact that the Australians
are having a double header in New Zealand with the
pain that excuse the pun that we've inflicted on them
in supercars over the last decade or so. I thought
it'd be sick to the back teeth. And Key has
had enough of all the ones over there. Now there's
a second wave coming through this. This is strange. Are
(39:30):
they showing to some kind of man love or something? Back?
Speaker 4 (39:34):
Oh, it's it's certainly, it's certainly cool.
Speaker 6 (39:37):
Like it's it's definitely when the when the when the
topor round comes around and especially this year that the
Kiwi fans just really get behind you and it's pretty special.
So it's it's definitely a cool weekend to be a
part of and from for me my first experience that
that was last year, and and I'll never forget how
(39:57):
many Kiwi fans there and what it truly meant to
them to have supercars back in New Zealand. And now
that we've got a double header, I think it's I
think it's going to be even more exciting, twice as
much action, and it's certainly certainly very very special for
New Zealand motorsport, and I think even even supercars as
a whole.
Speaker 3 (40:17):
You can register interest now to get tickets, and I
reckon people should be beating the door down because I
know what cantabs are like, that's where I'm from. When
I know what they think about motorsport. It's going to
be faresome, isn't it.
Speaker 6 (40:28):
It's it's going to be awesome. I think the crowd's
really going to turn it on and it's going to
be There's been some really good racing this year. I
think we've we've shown that and I think it's going
to be expected here at real Bo.
Speaker 3 (40:42):
And hopefully you can carry on the form even though
we've got half a season and some more before you
get back up. You're showing the moment and your grave
racing pen right car. You had a great weekend last
weekend and eight and a couple of third year. What
are you sitting in the championship right now? Third in
the championship? This is fantastic.
Speaker 6 (40:59):
Yeah, it's been. It's been going really well, especially the
last few weekends. We've been the tracks that we haven't
I haven't previously had success out in the past, so
it's nice to really turn that around and and have.
Speaker 7 (41:14):
Some really good results and.
Speaker 6 (41:15):
Bag some some big points before we get into the
back half of the season just to just to lock
in that spot in the finals. So it's definitely it's
definitely been really good. I'm really looking forward to the
to the rest of the year. I think there's some
awesome tracks coming up that you know, we have had
success at, so it's going to be pretty exciting rolling
out to there and see what we got.
Speaker 1 (41:36):
You no need for the DMO. We've got the breakdown
on Sports Talk cool wait News Talk said.
Speaker 3 (41:46):
Seven minutes to eight Sports Talk Era on News Talk
is z B. I'm Darcy new Sporting Weather, approaching Marcus
Slush around the corner. Jeez, you think the referees get abused?
Come sit in this seat and read the text lines.
(42:13):
Oh yeah, cowards, Come on, meet me outside the building.
Whatever we chat, it's this News Talks EB. I'm Darcy
waller Grave. Thanks very much for joining us over the
last hour of Sports Talk. Back again tomorrow from seven
to eight. Of course he'll Sport Break between seven and
nine a m. Saturday on News Talks EDB. Been crazy
(42:34):
a couple of days, dodging and weaving, if you will,
around the issues we have at a refereeing level and
the reaction they get from fans who don't understand a
pretty basic concept. The referee runs the show. It's their show.
They are the boss. They are the final judge, jury,
(42:55):
and execution. It you don't like it, don't watch it,
just leave, don't turn up, get in the c seyah.
Speaker 1 (43:16):
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