May 26, 2025 • 72 mins
Few actors can summarize “Existentialist Thought and its Effect on Quantum Physics” AND play baseball in the 24th century, but legendary character actor Keone Young is up to the challenge!
He appeared as a Pennbrook professor during Season 6 of Boy Meets World, but now it's time to dig deeper and find out more about his prolific career. Whether it was Golden Girls, Family Matters or Deadwood, Keone has brought a passion, and professional approach, to everything he's ever done - including this podcast!
And the man who's voiced hundreds of characters in animated shows and video games reveals how a job in theater lighting started it all.
He may not have felt welcomed on Boy Meets World, but now in 2025? It's time to roll out the red carpet for a very recognizable face...on a new Pod Meets World!
Follow @podmeetsworldshow on Instagram and TikTok!
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
So, I you guys know how much I love shoes.
One of my gifts from writer here is a shoe candle.
I just, I have loved shoes since I was a kid.
I loved my mom's shoes. Then when I was old
enough to start buying my own shoes, I've just I've
loved heels and Espa drills and sneakers and wedges and.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
What's an Esqua drill? I'm sorry I heard. I understood
everything else, but what's an drill?
Speaker 3 (00:48):
Is a type of poem. It's sixteen lines exactly. Doesn't
it sound like it should be.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
In a drill that drills and the screw the other direction.
It's an Espa drill.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
What what is an Espa drill? It's I'll show you
Espa drill wedges. It's like, this is a classic Espa
drill right there?
Speaker 3 (01:05):
It went away, but yeah I saw it.
Speaker 1 (01:07):
Yeah, that's an Espa drill.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
Okay, okay.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
Sometimes they sometimes they lace up around your ankle. Is
that like shoe?
Speaker 3 (01:16):
Yeah, it's a heeled sandal, kind of.
Speaker 1 (01:19):
Like a heeled sandal. Yeah, they're definitely a flat well,
I mean there's also these these are flat versions of it.
Speaker 2 (01:25):
So it's a totally different thing.
Speaker 1 (01:28):
This is so, this is what the definition is. A
flat shoe with a cloth upper, a rope sole, and
sometimes lacing that ties around the ankle, so that as
long as it has the rope bottom and a cloth top,
the shape of the shoe can be anything.
Speaker 4 (01:44):
And then it sounds like what they would have worn
on ships and stuff like rope bottom, cloth top.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
I kind of like them, are there, male? Can you
get men's esp drills?
Speaker 1 (01:56):
Yeah? I'm going to get an s P A A
U D R I L L EAT for men. Okay,
are you looking them up?
Speaker 3 (02:08):
Yeah, I'm gonna get some pirate shoes exact.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
That's what they're called.
Speaker 5 (02:11):
From now on. Those are.
Speaker 1 (02:15):
Well, there are when you love shoes, there are just
some shoes that like really give you the ick, you know,
like like say, I mean crocs used to be one
of them, for sure, before crocs became so mainstream and
in your face that everybody wore them. But even crocs
(02:38):
took me a really long time to get past. I
was like, nope, never, you could never convince to wear crocs.
But I used to feel that way about Birkenstocks.
Speaker 2 (02:50):
Oh yeah, oh gross.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
No, Well guess what. The pandemic changed many things for me. Also,
becoming a mother changed many things for me. I bought
my first pair of Crocs during the pandemic. And I
bought my first pair of Birkenstocks when Adler was little
and we were going on a vacation and I was
going to be doing a ton of walking and I
(03:15):
need support. And everyone's like, oh, once you break in
your pair of Birkenstocks, they're the You can spend fourteen
hours walking around a city in them. So I did.
I got my first pair of Birkenstocks that broke them
in greatest, most comfortable shoe, never a shoe pain. If
I'm in a pair of Birkenstocks, I can wear them
for literally twelve hours going anywhere. I walked around Austria
(03:37):
totally fine. Yesterday I put on a pair of shoes
that are so icky. Do you know the shoes that
have individual pockets for your toast?
Speaker 4 (03:53):
Oh my god, the yes rocks.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
Yes, I do.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
Okay, So I went to the gym yesterday. As you know,
very healthy lifestyle I've picked up over the last couple
of months have changed my eating habits, have started working out,
I've it has helped me, not at all. I've only
gained weight. I don't know how to explain it, but
I feel better. I do feel better, so I'm keeping
up with it. Anyway. Went to the gym yesterday to
(04:22):
do a met con class, which is a hit workout,
a high intensity interval training workout. You use weights and
you do these ten exercises. You do them three you
do them all ten of them. Then you start over
and you do them again three times. You do each
exercise for a minute. At my gym, the Poluva shoe
people were there and they were like, for this class only,
(04:42):
we are giving away free socks to anyone who would
like to try the shoes, and you can just wear
them for this class and then we'd love your honest feedback.
Tell us what you think about them. And I was like, yeah,
you know what, I'm gonna try it. Why not do
out there? Put on socks that have five daoles for
(05:04):
each of my toes, and then I put toes in
the shoes. They're freaking phenomenal.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
Not don't be that guy, bro.
Speaker 1 (05:15):
I will never ever wear them out to like run
an errand, but I am thinking about buying some for weightlifting.
I can't even believe I'm saying it. I got pictures. Look,
I need to show you guys. First of all, the
bottoms of them are so cute, like I have little
panda feet.
Speaker 3 (05:37):
So just your Wiki feet page is about to get
an update.
Speaker 1 (05:39):
And the bottom of these shoes, okay, and then look look,
look look, and they feel cool. They feel great. So
here's what I like about it.
Speaker 3 (05:49):
I'm so worried about each one of my toes. I
don't know, just stuff.
Speaker 1 (05:51):
Here's what's great. And this is what they tried to
tell me. And at first I was like, I don't
understand what you're talking about. With normal shoes and the
way our feet are in them and as thick as
they are, and with the not having individual toe brackets,
you don't actually like your toes don't really grip the ground.
All of your toes don't really grip the ground. They're
just kind of like in your shoes. With these shoes.
(06:14):
Because all of my toes were housed in their own
little home. When I would have to do something balancing,
so say I had heavy weights in my hands and
I was doing like a lunge that then where I
lifted my back foot and so I'm balancing on my
front foot. All of a sudden, all of my toes
were gripping the ground, kind of the way they do
when you're barefoot, like if you were doing yoga or
(06:35):
pilates and you're able to feel yourself and you can
like look down at your foot and realize, like, oh,
I need to put I have all my weight in
my pinky toe. I need to put more weight in
the ball on my foot. You can feel all of
that with these shoes on. They were really grippy, so
I was still able to run around on the floor.
They're hideous. They're the ugliest shoes I've ever seen in
my entire life, and I could never be seen in them.
(06:57):
But I am thinking about buying a pair.
Speaker 2 (07:00):
Would they in any way shape or form, uh like
get in.
Speaker 4 (07:06):
Like screw up your man bun if you're wearing them.
I'm curious, would they mess Would they mess with that?
Speaker 1 (07:12):
They would screw They'd screw up your macho ltte, your ice.
Speaker 2 (07:15):
I'm wondering about that, your cargo shorts and your man but.
Speaker 1 (07:18):
Your petuli is a little less.
Speaker 2 (07:20):
Potent, Okay, I'm just I'm just checking.
Speaker 1 (07:24):
Yeah, because you.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
Can still do the devil sticks though, right, that's that's.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
That's great, you can still do that. I love that anyway.
Speaker 1 (07:32):
I did think you guys would not would just not
expect me to be an ugly shoe lady.
Speaker 2 (07:37):
No, we call those douche shoes at our house.
Speaker 1 (07:40):
I love that douche.
Speaker 2 (07:41):
Yeah, we do.
Speaker 1 (07:42):
Oh, I love it so much, the douche, the douche shoes,
the douche shoe.
Speaker 2 (07:46):
So that's that's kind of what we call those. But hey,
I think you talk to me album no, to each
their own.
Speaker 4 (07:51):
I mean, that's no, it makes sense because if you
if you then have the same conversation, but around hands,
you're talking about the difference between wearing a pair of
gloves and which makes it, which does make a big difference.
Speaker 2 (08:07):
But yeah, but no, but I just you know, it
is what it.
Speaker 1 (08:11):
Is, and I do think because then I so I
left and I was like, I'm going to look these
shoes up. I'm going to see how much they are.
And I was looking at them and I did. Then
first of all, they're so so hideous on the website.
I was like, I just wore them and they didn't
look that hideous in person. On the website, I'm like,
(08:32):
they this is it couldn't possibly be this ugly. And
and I did stop myself from buying a pair because
I thought, am I ever going to be able to
get out of my own head when I'm wearing these
or the whole time? Am I going to be like
that person over there staring at my ugly feet? Shooes?
Speaker 4 (08:49):
Yeah, I don't be able to do. If you're going
to do it, you have to just jump in with No.
Speaker 1 (08:54):
You guys have single to.
Speaker 3 (09:00):
Talk you out of it.
Speaker 1 (09:01):
For weight lifting, Yeah no, No, it's good.
Speaker 4 (09:03):
I like you shouldn't define you or be stereotypical. I
do put on your broken stocks, get into your super
and go and buy the douche shoes.
Speaker 6 (09:14):
I think they'll be great. I don't see the problem.
What's no, I'm good. I'm good even with the cute
little bottom pand of feet. I'm not gonna not gonna
do it now.
Speaker 3 (09:27):
I would not judge you for shaming me. I know
I would not.
Speaker 4 (09:30):
I would not every time you put them on. He
would unabashedly shame you the whole time.
Speaker 3 (09:37):
I'm just worried about the comfort. I just whenever I
see like the idea of wrapping every one of my toes,
like exactly, that's what I mean. You don't, yeah, you know,
it seems like it wouldn't fit. Like it's just like
my toes would be too fat for one of them.
Speaker 1 (09:50):
I just need it is. It is weird because my
big toe was like a little too long for that
size of shoe, but my pinky toe was nowhere near
the end of it. So like if I went up
a different size, my would have my big toe would
have more room, but my pinky it could be cost
a mold one for you, they told me when I
said that, They said, but part of the reason your
pinky toe doesn't take up enough room is because it's
so used to being squished in your regular shoes.
Speaker 2 (10:13):
So they're pinky suffocating your petto.
Speaker 1 (10:17):
My pinky toe has shrunk itself in order to fit
into the fabric of this society.
Speaker 3 (10:21):
And if I could, in order to appeal to people
like you who call her douche shoes, if she likes
the wrong shoes.
Speaker 1 (10:28):
My pinky could have its own identity.
Speaker 2 (10:30):
You do you it doesn't? You go out there and
you bet the bottom shoes bag you can.
Speaker 3 (10:36):
That's how I look at it. Be in a douchebag.
It's it's it's wearing what you want. Wear that hair bun.
Speaker 2 (10:42):
Of course, wear that hair bun.
Speaker 1 (10:45):
Neglect your feet. If you guys want your pinky toes
to continue to shrink themselves to fit into society.
Speaker 3 (10:50):
I am I'm totally are you? Are you well? Because
you know I don't have beach shoes. I hate anything
that actually shows my feet. This is perfect. These are
beachy shoes that I can wear. They're like sandals, but
I don't have to Actually, you know, one has to
look at my hobby feet.
Speaker 1 (11:05):
It's perfect. Will you update us when you get your
male espadral? Yeah, okay, thank you. Welcome to Pod meets World.
Speaker 2 (11:12):
I'm Daniel Fishl, I'm right or Strong, and I'm Will Fordell.
Speaker 1 (11:27):
If we've said it once, we've said it a million times.
For the most part, we were pretty self absorbed as
kids on the set of Boy Meets World. The sheer
number of adult actors Will could have talked to about
their time on MASH or the stories Bill could have
told us about the making of the graduate, or the
moments I could have at least remembered from the run
of the show. They all seem like missed opportunities that
(11:47):
now with a rewatch podcast three decades later, we can
right those wrongs and not only shine a spotlight on
some of these incredible talents that joined us on set,
but we can learn more about them, even if a
little late. And this week we get to right our
wrongs once again. With a career spanning over fifty years,
our guest this week has two hundred and eighty one
acting credits to his name. You may have seen him
(12:08):
steal scenes on the genius HBO show Deadwood, or appear
in movies like Men in Black three and the adrenaline
laced cult hit Crank, or on TV where he kicked
off his career with appearances on shows like Different Strokes,
Heart to Heart, Saint Elsewhere, and Webster. He's the absolute
definition of a working actor, still acting and making a
killing as one of the most prolific voice actors working today,
(12:32):
with classics like Narudo, Gi Joe, Samurai Jack, Teen Titans,
and Avatar The Last Airbender. On a long, long resume.
Speaker 5 (12:41):
He's awesome, He's awesome.
Speaker 3 (12:44):
Yeah, Yeah, Avatar the Last Mayorbender is one of those
classes I've never watched.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
Everyone just in Gi Joe.
Speaker 1 (12:49):
I mean, come on, yeah, But for some reason, and
we don't know why, he's agreed to join us this
week to talk about the one time he played a
professor at Penbrook University dealing with a group of bright
eyed freshmen on our Meager family sitcom for season six's
Ain't College Great? This week we're talking to one of
the most impressive guest stars we have ever had. Please
(13:10):
welcome keone Young.
Speaker 5 (13:15):
Hello.
Speaker 1 (13:16):
Thank you so much for joining us. We are honored
that you would share some of your time with us
to talk about your very prolific career. Just trying to
get your first credit on IMDb takes several minutes. Yes,
so you were raised in Hawaii. Both of your parents
had immigrated to the United States. Your father Chinese.
Speaker 5 (13:39):
No, actually they didn't immigrant. They were born in Hawaii, Okaya.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
Tell us about your upbringing.
Speaker 5 (13:47):
I'm a third generation from My grandfather was from China.
My grandmother and grand father on my mother's side was
from Japan. But my parents were born in Honolulu, hoois Okay.
Speaker 1 (14:01):
And so what was their reaction when you decided to
pursue a career in the entertainment industry.
Speaker 5 (14:09):
Well, I have to tell you that. You know, for
Asians who emigrated to this country, they came as agricultural people.
They came as peasants. My grandparents worked in the fields
you know of in the sugarcane and pineapple fields, and
(14:29):
that's where Hawaii became very commercially, very viable for the
United States because they provided a lot of sugar for
the country. So my grandparents were indentured workers to plantations.
So my grandfather and grandmother wanted their my grandparents wanted
(14:54):
their kids to be educated. So my my parents were
were the first to go to school, finish high school
and from from there where they fed kind of like
this new workforce during the fifties through the Eisenhower years,
the post war years. Their dream was for their kids
(15:16):
to become doctors, lawyers, or even a dentist. Yeah, that
was the lowest acceptable. Let you do that. That was acceptable.
And you know, I just I was really a bad student,
(15:41):
and you know, having kids myself, I realized that school.
You know, my son told me I want to quit
school at third grade and I said why and he said, well,
school kills my creativity. And I couldn't argue that with him,
because they did that for me, because I come from
(16:02):
school in the sixties where everything was you know, you
by wrote, there's no creativity at all. You know, you
had to memorize your multiplication tables. You had to memorize
all your science for me, you know, and I just
I couldn't. My brain didn't function that way. And so
I was a real bad student. So I was considered
(16:24):
what we call in Japanese yogo day, which means dirty,
you know, the filthy part of life, A person who
is scum actually so and I mean scum, I mean
the residue of the bottom side of society. And I
(16:45):
found and because I was regarded as such, you know,
my my friends, my friend's parents would say, oh, don't,
don't play with him, don't, don't, you know, because he's
he's no good. So I found a family in the theater.
I wanted to work in theater. I wanted to actually
(17:09):
I want to build sets. I wanted to design lights.
I hung lights. I was I was a kid, I
was like fourteen fifteen. I wasn't afraid to go up
into the to the fly they call it, fly and
hang lights. And I was mentored by some good technical people,
you know, and as I was in. I was in
(17:32):
the Humblu Community Theater. There is a long story. I
hope you have the time we do so. In the
Hullelo Community Community Theater, I'd be from up in the flies.
I'd be watching actors and I thought I'd be thinking,
they're not that good.
Speaker 1 (17:51):
I don't like what they're doing.
Speaker 5 (17:53):
Now It's not I didn't like. I just thought, well,
I don't believe them, you know. Yeah, and I and
of course a lot of the actors during that time,
they didn't want to do small parts, you know. So
directors would come up to me and go, hey, kid,
we need a waiter in the scene to come in
and take an order. Would you do it? So while
(18:14):
moving the sets and you know, doing the lights, I'd go,
I'd say okay, and I'd do it one line. And
I did a lot of great plays. I was in
the Death of a Salesman. I played the waiter and
Death of a Salesman. Right, come in and I say,
can I take your order, sir? One a cup of coabi?
Thank you. But but what forced me then was I'd
(18:37):
be able to watch a play like Arthur Miller's Death
of a Salesman and and gain benefits from it. Realize,
you know, school was important, but this is life drama
and this, you know. I watched, you know, and then
I would meet young people from New York who would say, hey,
(19:00):
read Tennessee Williams read, Edward Alby read Chekhov. And I
would go up into the They had this little library
in the theater and i'd sit there and i'd work
as a janitor there too, just to you know, pay
for classes and whatever. And I'd read all these wonderful plays.
(19:25):
I read out Edward Alby the Zoo Story, and I
was like, wow, this is fantastic. So I got inspired
to the theater. And also, if you know musicals, you
know there's a lot of chorus parts where people would
would sing and dance, and I was oftentimes they actors
(19:51):
didn't want to be in these chorus parts, so they'd
throw me in there because I had a bass voice.
And it was really funny because at fourteen and fifteen,
there was a young woman who was a year older
than me, who was in sort of the same position,
who kind of like befriended me and who showed me
(20:12):
how kind theater people were to me. They didn't judge
me if I didn't have the credentials like being a doctor,
a lawyer of four point oh you know, yeah, student,
and she we kind of like I did My Fair
Lady with her, and it was really funny because you know,
(20:34):
I spoke to local patois. But then I had to
learn how to relearn how to speak standard stage speech,
and you know, so I'm getting married in the morning,
I'd have to learn cognitia yes, and did how to
succeed in business without really trying. And she became she
(20:54):
was like, you know, like just a not a really
good We had these good looking women stars in there,
you know, and they would always kind of like, oh,
treat her like very patronizing to her. But she was
a very beautiful person and very beautiful voice. So at eighteen,
(21:15):
and I was seventeen, she said, I'm going to New
York study become an actress, which kind of inspired me.
I didn't have enough money to go to New York,
so I had enough money to go to California. Yeah,
I came to California. I had four hundred dollars in
my pocket. And that lady was Bet Middler, by the way,
Oh yeah, she became Bet Middler. So I said, Wow,
(21:41):
that's nice. You know that it could happen to someone
who I grew up with, that's amazing. And so that's
the story. I came to LA. I had four hundred
dollars in my pocket, two pairs of pants, two pairs
of shirts, I mean a pair of shirts. And so.
Speaker 1 (22:01):
Where did you live? Did you have a roommate? Where?
How did you find a place to stay?
Speaker 5 (22:06):
Well, I applied my mother, being the Asian mother, applied
to several colleges, which all rejected me because my GPA.
But Pasadena Playoffs took me amazing. It was a college
of theater arts back in the sixties. It was very
famous at that time. Gene Hackman went there, Dustin Hoffman
(22:30):
went there. So they accepted me. I worked during the
summer to pay for the fee, and I didn't know
they needed the money really bade so they took a
lot of people. Yeah, and I went to people like
in my class were Stally Struthers from you know father
(22:53):
that three company.
Speaker 2 (22:55):
Oh, No, Sally from from from all in the family.
Speaker 5 (22:58):
All in the family. Yeah. And I don't know if
you know Ben Murphy, he was in Alias Smith and Jones.
He was so anyway, So I studied there for two
years and I was able to survive it and graduate,
and I found out, oh, this is an interesting thing
(23:22):
I was looking. I was. I worked during its school
in the library, and I came across past students at
East at Pastina playoffs, and I'd see names like Dustin Hoffman,
Gene Hackman went there, and it inspired me. And then
(23:43):
I saw this picture of this Asian guy because I
thought I was the first Asian guy that went to
Pasadena Playhouse, but there was another guy there and his
name was Maco, and I found out he was nominated
for Academy Award for San Pebbles. Consequently, he was nominated
for a Tony even Somendheims Pacific Overtures, And so I said, wow,
(24:05):
that's inspirational. So I've been having all these as a
failure that I was as a person, you know, according
to my status in life, I was fortunate to have
all these experiences and these moments of like inspiration. So
I said, wow, he got nominated for an Academy Award
with Steve McQueen and Candy Bergen, and so I, you know,
(24:32):
I was motivated. And then I came to La and
I met him. I found him and he had founded
a theater called the East West Players, and I had
been a member there. And his philosophy was like, actors
have to learn everything, not just because acting is like
(24:53):
is not a defined science, you know, where one method
is a correct answer to any every situation. He would say,
actors have to learn the sciences that surround acting, which
is dance, music. So he sent me to New York
in seventy six, and he told me go to New
(25:15):
York and study because LA is full of Hollywood actors.
He said, they don't know nothing. So I went to
New York. I studied, you know, method Gratowski. I studied ballet.
I went to opera. I studied modern dance. You know,
everything I studied, I learned through music theory. I learned
(25:38):
to play an instrument. I learned about classical music, Western
and Asian. I went to Berlitz. I studied languages. So
he made he forced me to study, and he was
He went to do Pacific overtures for some time at
that time in seventy six, and he kind of funded me.
(25:58):
You know, yeah, I mean I had to borrow two
thousand from my screen actors. Guild Credit Union as well
in order to live. So I have to thank the
Credit Union for funding my education at that time. So
I was on there on my own. I lived at
the YMCA, and I've been studying ever since. Studying is
(26:21):
just part of being an actor. I study today, I
have classes today, I study.
Speaker 4 (26:25):
It is so incredible and Maco is I mean, forget
being hugely important to me for my favorite show of
all time, mash where he must have played eight or
nine different characters, but Conan, his role in Conan the
Barbarian and ConA the Destroyer, like helped to define me
as a kid.
Speaker 5 (26:43):
They were sicking.
Speaker 4 (26:45):
Well, yeah, because I mean I'm a fantasy nerd. And
he was one of the first quote unquote wizards I
ever saw, because he played a sorcerer and a wizard
in Conan. And I think I was eight or nine
when it came out and it was just awe inspiring.
Speaker 2 (26:58):
So yeah, he was alleged.
Speaker 5 (27:00):
Can I tell you a little funny story about Conan,
please please, Well what had happened was Arnold had hired
One of his requirements was that the director had to
hire all his buddies so Arnold could train with them.
While he was there in Spain, and one director hired
(27:22):
them to play all these warriors and muscle. Uh, these
these bad guys. Well, one thing that they did was
they developed every muscle in their body except one muscle,
and that was the voice musk, the throat muscle. So
they all came talking like this.
Speaker 2 (27:45):
The way it was John Millis, John Milias.
Speaker 5 (27:49):
So I had a meeting with John, you know, and
John said I can't have this because they were all time,
I will kill you. And John was this kind of
like Asiano file who loved Kurosawa, you know, I don't
know if you know. He did the Seventh Summarise and
me fooney and all that. So John said, I'm going
(28:10):
to play this movie the scene, this battle scene, and
this is how I want the battle scene to sound. Well,
Maco had introduced me to John and said, John, hire
this kid. And so I said, John, you don't have
to run. I used to watch that on my grandmother's lap.
So I know the movie backwards and forwards. I know
the sound that you want. So I recreated all these
(28:32):
Samurai voices, you know, for John. So I replaced all
these muscle men and made men out of them cool,
and that was in Conan Barbarian and that kind of
like was a trajectory for me and my If you've
seen my IMDb, I've done a lot of voice work. Yeah,
(28:52):
that was a trajectory for me to start working in
voice because I said, Wow, I don't have to I
can wear my pajamas exactly, get up and walk to
I don't don't have to worry about, you know, having
these two hour early calls before I hit the set.
Speaker 2 (29:08):
With the makeup makeup man.
Speaker 5 (29:12):
So yeah, so that's my con end story.
Speaker 1 (29:26):
Let's jump into your TV career a little bit. You
began your career on shows like Room two twenty two
and Kojak and movies like Private Benjamin. But I think
most of our audience may have first seen you on
different strokes, So I wanted to talk to you about
that experience and but also the kinds of roles you
were auditioning for as an Asian American.
Speaker 5 (29:48):
Well, let me just say this to you quite frankly,
that Asian Americans are not seen as Americans. Of my
roles has been as a foreigner, right, so, which was
really difficult for for many of us because when we
(30:09):
were growing up our parents said, no, you're American, don't
speak our language. So you know, it was a kind
of like a contradiction. Here I was in Hollywood, and
I realized that shortly. I said, Wow, they only see
me as a foreigner. But I speak English, and I
(30:30):
can speak English better than a lot of English. So
so different strokes. So I had to learn to adjust.
I had to learn to learn other people's cultures, which
I was fortunate because I was in Hawaiian and it
was multicultural. You know. We grew up with Japanese, Chinese, Koreans, Filipinos, Vietnamese,
(30:56):
Portuguese and so on, so I kind of learned the culture.
So different strokes was interesting. You know. At night I
would be doing Ibsen and Tennessee Williams, like I said, Albi,
and then in the day I would be doing stuff
like different strokes and Golden Girls and stuff like that,
(31:18):
and I was kind of weighing what is most important
to me, you know. I was doing regional theater. I
went to Milwaukee, I went to New Hampshire. I was
traveling around the country working for peanuts. And then I
would do these TV shows and make incredible amounts of money,
and I just could not understand it, the contributions. So
(31:43):
what I found out though, was that when people were
working in Hollywood, and particularly in TV, and particularly in
three camera comedy, people were very anxious about their longevity
and their life. Yeah, people always worried and scared, particularly
the adults, whether they were going to get canceled, what
(32:05):
their ratings were, where they were going to live, where
their character was going to die, whether they were whether
the writer, producer, runner of the show was happy with them,
you know, because if they weren't, they might be written
out of the show, or they not enough dialogue. So
I said, well, it's good. I'm I can't you know,
(32:28):
I'm I'm just a guest there, and I'll be a
guest everywhere I go. I'll never be a part of
this infrastructure, you know, I'll never be part of that society.
Number One, they wouldn't allow us in unlike today you
might see more of us because we fought for that.
But I said, you know, I cannot rely on these people.
(32:50):
I just have to do my own thing. So I
was never worried about being fired, or being a band
or being how would you say an outcast? I mean,
I just did my thing. And I guess there was
some smart enough people to realize, Yeah, that guy knows
(33:15):
m he's always on time, he always knows his lines,
he always hits his mart get them, yeah, you know,
And I realized that I would spend more time being
proficient and efficient as opposed to trying to get somebody
to love me.
Speaker 1 (33:33):
Right.
Speaker 5 (33:34):
So, I don't know, I really I really felt a contradiction.
You know. I was happy doing this show, but as
I watched the kids around me, I was kind of
sad at the same time, if you know what I mean.
And it was very sad because I felt no one's
(33:58):
really educating the young people about the potential of their potential,
you know. And consequently what happened was proved to be true.
I loved working with the old timers. Conrad Bain was
a wonderful gentleman who came from theater and he could
(34:21):
understand me, and so we kind of bonded there and
it was it was enjoyable. I'll say one other thing,
like like Golden Girls. Golden Girls, everybody would warn me
about be Arthur. Yeah, they say, oh, you got to
watch out for her. She suffers the fools. Well, she
doesn't but she does appreciate actors who are serious. And
(34:47):
when I did the scene with her, it was it
was delightful because she was she was good.
Speaker 2 (34:53):
Oh yeah, one of the best ever on television.
Speaker 5 (34:57):
I think, so. I mean she was. She was very good,
very professional, and she was a fellow I don't want
to say the word artists. I never refer to myself
as one a fellow artisan, you know, very craft. She
was respected the craft, and that's what I really loved
(35:19):
about her.
Speaker 1 (35:20):
Well, you would go on to appear on literal classic
TV shows like Taxi, The Jefferson's, Cheers, and Saint Elsewhere,
alongside our pwell William Daniels. Yeah, did you ever feel like,
you know, that sense you had as a kid that
you weren't going to amount to much because you weren't
(35:41):
the traditional good student. Did you ever feel like you
were making it moving here from Hawaii and booking so
much incredible work?
Speaker 5 (35:49):
No? No, wow, Because you know, my mother's friends, their
sons were doctors and lawyers and very very wealthy, very established,
and my mom was very impressed because they grew up
in the Eisenhower days, they grew up the Rockefeller days,
they grew up in the how to influence people, you know,
(36:13):
with your magnanimity. They would love Donald Trump today because
he was wealthy, and that would be the criteria. I'm me,
I'm presuming, yeah, But I tell you one time I
did I did. I did a movie The Week with
(36:36):
Karen Allen and it was about the Challenger Shuttle. You
remember the shuttle that carsonal So I played one of
the astronauts, Elison on a Zuka who was on the
flight at that time. And I went home and in
Hawaii and finally my mom was kind of proud of me.
(37:00):
And then but then she would go around to her
friends going like, well, you know where he got his
talent from?
Speaker 2 (37:09):
So taking credit, no praise, but taking credit.
Speaker 5 (37:11):
Wow, well you know because I was, you know, when
high school, I was, you.
Speaker 1 (37:16):
Know, in a play in a play.
Speaker 5 (37:19):
Wow, So I really you know, it was it was
kind of funny. But when my dad asked me how
much money I made, and I made a lot of money,
as you can imagine, he just he would not believe
me because what I made in a week he made
in a year. So they all kind of like in
(37:40):
the final decades kind of like was proud, but they
were proud because I was part of the family.
Speaker 4 (37:48):
You know, I have to ask about the about the
the the movie of the week was Karen Allen, Krista mccaulloff.
Speaker 5 (37:55):
Yeah, okay, and Barry Bostwick was in it, you know, man,
Peter Boy was in it. It was it was a
fun project. Yeah. Wow.
Speaker 1 (38:07):
Let's get into your time on Boy Meets World. Do
you remember the audition for the role of Professor?
Speaker 5 (38:15):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (38:16):
Yeah, And what was that like?
Speaker 5 (38:20):
It was like any other job. You know, I've going
on auditions for all kinds of stuff. So if if
you know the role, I mean it was just gibberish, right,
and so I just didn't get gibberish.
Speaker 1 (38:36):
We talked about it when we recapped the episode, because
you say it was just gibberish, as if doing gibberish
is actually easy. It is not. We all like practiced
on the day we recapture episode.
Speaker 2 (38:53):
And none of us could do it.
Speaker 1 (38:54):
None of us could even come close.
Speaker 3 (38:56):
It's one of those things that conceptually, like even if
you wrote it, you'd be like, oh, that'll be funny,
but to actually deliver it and sell it is really difficult.
Speaker 5 (39:04):
Well, you know, sound is as important as words. You know.
That's what I was taught from my mentor Macco. He says,
sound tells you the truth, and just you go back
on this tape and listen to yourselves. How much sound
you just said? Hmm, And it has subtext to it.
(39:27):
So sound is very important. When we're singing opera, we're
singing Italian and like, I don't know what it means, right,
you know, when I'm singing German, I'm singing Ontie music
and Schubert's under music to hold the kunsin vivel gauen Stunden.
I don't know what the actual meaning is. I've since learned,
(39:52):
but while I'm singing it, I'm kind of like thinking
of the German you know, at that time, and you
know the music of Bach and and sound is really important.
So sound was not a problem with me because I
grew up in a country or a state that sound.
(40:15):
You know. I would hear the Filipinos speaking and the
Koreans speaking, and their sounds were, for example, like Chinese
would in a moment of expression, they would say ah yeah, uh,
Koreans would uh. Koreans would say aigh. Philippines with withoud
(40:36):
Filipino you would say, oh no, and in Japanese you
would say, ah yah. They are all sounds, and there's
sounds that relate to what you feel, deep feelings that
you feel. So sound was not difficult for me. What
was difficult was, you know, when you do three camera,
(40:58):
I'm really talking a lot. I don't know why, because
maybe because.
Speaker 1 (41:01):
That's wanted to talk to you.
Speaker 5 (41:07):
Usually I don't spend that much time explaining. But with
other actors, I think you guys could understand it, really sure.
But when you when you're working in three camera comedy
and you know, I work with guys like Bud Yorkin
and Norman Lear and those guys, and it was brutal,
bruialty No, but it was brutal because Bud would come down,
(41:30):
you know, after you have a run through and he'd
watched run through, he'd come down with a martini with
his guys and they would sit there and criticize. And
you know, these guys were not they were not theater people.
They didn't you know, they were just they wanted the laugh,
they wanted the moment of response. They wanted results, well,
(41:55):
results in terms of the scene, in terms of acting.
They wanted results and Wow, I was not that. I
was the type of actor where I bet, like you know,
we loved Brando, you know, like searching and wondering and
you know that was our kind of like hero when
when I was a kid, and and James Dean and
(42:19):
we try to find the moment of the scene, and
they weren't interested in the moment of the scene. They
wanted to laugh, you know. It was rhythm.
Speaker 1 (42:25):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (42:26):
So I when you say the audition I just I
mean the gibberish part wasn't the problem of it was.
It was. It was the results and what the showrunner wanted.
Speaker 1 (42:46):
So when so you get the job, you come, you come.
You're on set with us during that week. What do
you remember that week about the rehearsal process taping, because,
like you mentioned, we had a showrunner that would come
down after, you know, run through and give very long notes.
What was your experience that week.
Speaker 5 (43:03):
Well, for the young people, I really liked them. They
were very respectful to me, you know, and I liked
all the young people.
Speaker 1 (43:12):
That would have been us.
Speaker 5 (43:16):
Yeah, I mean they were very supportive and friendly to me.
They would bring up shows movies that they had seen
me and you know, yeah, and we talked. The older
people were always like nervous, particularly with the showrunner, you know,
like is he upset? Is he mad? Did he think
I was funny? And I was going, well, that's not
(43:38):
a way to live a life for me anyway. And
so I was like on my tiptoes, you know, like
trying to like be careful, like just be careful that
I would make it through the week at my check
and then go on to do other things. I don't
know if you talk to the woman that kind of
(44:00):
like talk to me about this show, And I said,
it was not a really great experience for me. So
I don't know why they want to talk to me.
Speaker 1 (44:07):
We want to hear your experience good, bad, We want
to hear it all.
Speaker 5 (44:12):
Well, like I said, the showrunner was you know, pretty alpha,
pretty dominating.
Speaker 3 (44:17):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (44:18):
And I understood the necessity of it. I understood the
importance of that. I mean I had worked in many
many shows where like I said, I worked for Dorm
Bud yorkin you know, and Bud was doing the Red
Fox show and read banned him from the set and
read and he said, but Red, I owned the show,
(44:40):
and read, I don't care. I'm not coming to the
set if you're there. And ABC had called up Bud
York and had said, don't go down to the set, So,
you know, you have that kind of conflict and contradiction,
and I just I was like, not intimidated, but I
didn't want to be around that kind of you know,
(45:01):
and every three camera comedy I had seen it, you know, yeah,
and where the showrunner is the boss and there's no
way to have a conversation about it. You know, you
do what you're told or you're done. So my job
was just doing what I was told. That was it.
Speaker 1 (45:24):
Yep, get in, do it like this and leave, take
your shot, and then go do something that actually fills
your soul.
Speaker 5 (45:32):
Well yeah, but I enjoyed the people on the show.
There was one writer who can't remember his name, but
he was very kind, and like I said, the young
people were very fun to be with.
Speaker 1 (45:46):
Yeah. Yeah, well good, I'm glad. I'm glad at least
we were fun to be around.
Speaker 5 (45:52):
Yeah, I mean, I'm glad I was done with it.
Speaker 1 (45:54):
Yeah, yeah, you got to leave. Did you ever watch
the shows when they aired? Did you see your boy
Meets were all episode when it aired on TV?
Speaker 5 (46:01):
Eventually, I only watched it recently, really told me to
watch it.
Speaker 1 (46:07):
Yeah, what did you? What were your thoughts on it?
Speaker 5 (46:09):
Now?
Speaker 1 (46:10):
What were your thoughts watching it?
Speaker 5 (46:14):
I was terrible? You know how you think that we
as actors, you know, you always look at yourself. I
could have done that. I could. Of course, I should
have did this. I should have done it. You know,
I could have been better, which has always been my mantra.
You know, I can be better. I should be better.
You know. So such an actor thing.
Speaker 4 (46:35):
It's such an actor thing too, your Monday morning quarterback,
your own performance all the time. And oh if I
could just have given it a shot, if I could
do it one more time, I would have done this.
But the truth of the matter is, then if you
watched it a third time, you'd want to change the.
Speaker 2 (46:48):
Thing you just did again.
Speaker 3 (46:49):
It would it would never be.
Speaker 2 (46:51):
Perfect, no matter what you think.
Speaker 5 (46:53):
Yeah, yeah, but.
Speaker 1 (46:55):
We absolutely loved you in it.
Speaker 5 (46:59):
Yeah, thank you.
Speaker 1 (47:00):
Hysterical so funny, absolutely nailed it, laugh out loud funny,
I mean, truly sparked an entire discussion for us about
how much harder what you are doing, how much harder
it is than it looks it looks like? How I
mean you make it look seamless and effortless, and then
all of us, with effort, could not come close to it.
(47:20):
So truly, we also wanted to talk Deadwood with you,
where you played mister wu. This was a magical show
created by David Milch that even with all the acclaim
it did get deserved even more. Do you consider this
maybe the best thing you've ever done? And if not,
what do you think is the best thing you've ever done?
Speaker 5 (47:42):
Well? Yes, I was very fortunate to meet David Milch.
You know, oftentimes, like I said, people see us as foreigners.
Well we are in a sense, at least my grandparents were,
and I've always wanted the opportunity to show them, not
to glorify them, but to show them that they had
(48:05):
desires and passions too, And David Milt was open to that.
It's kind of character that I've I am and I've
always wanted to develop and he did too. So and
he did that with every character. You know, he did
(48:25):
that with every character. Find out get the essence of
what that character represented, what his dreams were, what his
failures were, and his inner dialogue, what we really thought
about the situation. It was just grand You know, just
to be on the set to work with as great actors.
(48:48):
I don't know about you, but you know, like that
old joke about when you look at a script you
go to my line, my line both, well, we would
like I would come down to the set just to
watch people act. Wow, yeah, and just watch scene. Billy sorry,
(49:11):
I can't think of his name. William Anderson, Billy Anderson.
He was in that Bob Newhart show. He was one
of the brothers. He played. Yeah. Uh, he played the
mayor of Deadwood, and he is such a great actor.
I would just go down to the set just to
watch him act. Uh. And it was just wonderful. It
(49:33):
was like being in school, you know, like being like
an actors studio where you go and watch somebody scene
and you'd learn from that, and Milts would come down
and explain to you what the scene was about and
how stupid you were, and you, you don't know. The
great feeling it is when somebody as smart as David
Milt comes up to you and go, that was stupid,
(49:59):
you know, And he goes, you know what I'm trying
to say, right, you know what I mean? Right? And
I go, yeah, I know what you mean. David, and
then we would go back and work it out. And
David was the kind of guy. He was great. I mean,
he feared nobody. You know, he'd go, we'd be on
season episode three and he go, he'd watch episode three
(50:20):
the scene and go, you know that scene in episode one,
I want to rewrite it. He took the producers and
he go, I think that I could make that scene better.
And they go, David, we have to rehire all those actors,
build a set, and he goes, I don't care to
(50:42):
do it because it will make me better. And I
think that's why HBO kind of like canceled it, because
it was it was an expensive show because of how
David wanted to do this show, and that's when TV
can be. It's yeah, I think, I think, I think,
(51:04):
you know, but.
Speaker 2 (51:05):
I mean watching it was it was. I remember the
first time, the first couple episodes, it hit me.
Speaker 4 (51:10):
I was like, oh, this is this is how Shakespeare
would do a Western.
Speaker 2 (51:16):
I mean it was it was that level.
Speaker 4 (51:17):
It was literally Shakespearean with the characters and there, I
mean there. It was amazing it what it did for television,
but also for the Western, where it was just such
on a different level all the way around.
Speaker 2 (51:29):
It was truly just one of the most magical things
that I think has ever been on television.
Speaker 4 (51:34):
And I know people would think that's that's a bold statement,
but I truly think it's deserving of that statement. It
is was magical. It really was lightning in a bottle.
It was all the ridiculous platitudes you hear about something
wonderful that was fleeting was Deadwood.
Speaker 2 (51:50):
It was incredible.
Speaker 5 (51:52):
Well, let me ask you this question, then, do you
think that every Western since Deadwood on TV? Successful successful
Western has been influenced by Deadwood?
Speaker 4 (52:02):
Oh?
Speaker 5 (52:03):
Absolutely, absolutely? Do you think not? I do. I read
an article recently that said every Western that has followed
dead Deadwood has something to be thankful for from.
Speaker 1 (52:18):
In some way Deadwood.
Speaker 2 (52:20):
Yeah, that's amazing.
Speaker 5 (52:22):
The struggle that we had, the challenge that we had
as actors was great because where in TV does a
challenge you to to surpass your present state and become
something greater. Where where in TV does that? You know?
(52:46):
And I find that that has carried me in my career.
I just recently did a a series with Jessica Bielle
in New York and it was one of the first
times I felt as an actor that I was complete,
(53:07):
that I had my own identity, that my identity was
not fined for you by the writer or the director,
or the or the producer, but that I had felt
that I had my own identity as the character, and
I had established it. And I guess that's what Deadwood
(53:32):
has allowed me to do, was to come onto every
project to be able to say, Okay, let me give
a dimension to this that is not just two dimensional
or four dimensional. Let me be more abstract, let me
let me uncover the character, and consequently, wow, that seems
(53:56):
to work for me. Which what I learned from Deadwood
that you're much more than the printed page is two dimensional? Right?
You read it on the page, You read on the
page eight times, and you think, oh, what can make
this work? Why? Right? Right? And you find it? And
so that pushed by David Mills, is find the character.
(54:20):
Don't be stupid, don't take the least common denominator, take
the highest common denominate, yes on the other extra spectrum
and challenge you as an actor. And I guess that's
what Didwood did. And I was very fortunate. I'm so
fortunate that I was to meet somebody like David Milch.
Speaker 1 (54:52):
I won't talk about all the video games that you
have worked on because those companies have to pay your
union first. But in animated product Jax, you voiced Naruto Avatar,
The Last Airbender, High High, Puffy on the Yumi Batman,
and now Gremlin's The Secrets of Maguai. All of these
projects have had huge spikes in popularity over the past
few years. Are you surprised by the mainstreaming of anime
(55:16):
and animated shows?
Speaker 5 (55:18):
No, let me tell you what I'm surprised about. That
is young people's devotion to it. Yeah, and I wish
it wasn't so much so, because they're obviously looking for
an outlet that relieves them from anxiety and pressures. And
(55:43):
I go to all these I'm invited to a lot
of comic cons Yeah, and I see young people just uh,
throwing themselves into that kind of like a cult of anime,
understanding what that anime means. In Japan, it's the same thing,
(56:07):
you know, you know in Japan. You know, Japan is
a very controlled society in terms of behavior and in
terms of how you relate to each other, in terms
of not only personal relationship, but in class relationship. There's
forms of language that you must speak if you're talking
(56:28):
to someone older than you, superior to you. And there's
a way to talk to somebody who's beneath you. In Japanese,
you know, to cuss somebody out, there's no real cuss words.
Is the word you and the different forms of you.
(56:50):
So I can have a formal way of saying you,
or I can have an informal way, and the way
you use it to somebody determines your really, So what
I'm trying to say is Japan has very control society
and they let their emotions out by watching all this
man manga and you know, you say, wow, they have
(57:10):
so much violence in their things. Well yeah, but that's
the one way what they use in order not to
commit violence. Yeah, but in America, kids are really like
put so much equity in these things. And it doesn't
(57:34):
bother me, but I just wish I could sit down
with them and say, oh, hey, you know why you're
doing this right? Yeah, you know, you know why. And
Star Wars has been becoming a cult as well, you know,
and it's fine, you should love these things, but you
should love them in terms of how that relates to
(57:55):
your life, that what you want to do with your
life and what you want how you want to be
progressive to progress. So when you say, am I surprised, No,
I'm not surprised because we live in a cult kind
of world right now. Well, we're not thinking for ourselves,
you know, we're not looking at factual evidence and heroes.
(58:22):
Heroes are not going to save our day for us ourselves.
And so it really bothers me that about this kind
of implosion of anime and manga. And you know, I mean,
it's it's great. We have cartoons. There's some really great
you know, like I don't know if you know the
(58:43):
history of like comics like Will Eisner who was uh,
who was a great great UH novelist, comic book novelist.
He wrote about the strugg of the Jews in the
Lower East Side during the Depression and uh, And that's
(59:07):
what I find kind of missing sometimes.
Speaker 1 (59:12):
Wow. Well, we talked we talked a little bit about
this with Stephen Park when he was on the podcast.
But obviously you have witnessed a total evolution of opportunities
for Asian actors in Hollywood. What are your feelings when
you see actors like Stephen Youn or Henry Golding starring
in massive movies without any signifying mark about their race.
Speaker 5 (59:36):
It's good, it's good. But you know in plays I've
done Gibson, I've done Chekhov, you know, I've done a
lot of and I think I laid that found is
my generation that kind of laid the foundation for them
thinking where they could go.
Speaker 1 (59:55):
Yes, sure, for sure.
Speaker 5 (59:57):
You know the generation before me, which was the first
generation that was with like people like Richard lou Kee Luke,
that generation. I'm the second generation. They were kind of
like immigrants and kind of fulfilling the role of being
the Asian you know, the Fu Manchu or the Asian
(01:00:18):
stereotype for what America needed in terms of like a
growing as a as a first world They needed to
picture the enemy properly for people, you know. And so
we came up and said, hey, you know, we're Americans too,
So we wanted so and theater was our outlet because
(01:00:41):
like I said, I think I said of the characters
I played in Foreigners, and to see that change now
is very is very good. It's what we've worked for
as a community of Asian American performers in this country.
Don't forget that we got reparations for when Japanese Americans
(01:01:04):
were interned during the war. We got reparations from the
an apology from Ronald Reagan. So that l Mark was
very important for us because it showed, hey, we are
humans too, which consequently transferring itself to a lot of writers, novelists.
(01:01:31):
You know who wrote Crazy Rich Asians and who wrote
all these books and Maxine Hank Kingston and Amy Tanned
they wrote all these novels and then movies were made
from them, which is really good. But I just have
one question, one point of view that you might not
(01:01:51):
agree with me, and I'm sure it will offend a
lot of people that Asian men are still shown uh
yeh in a non positive light. It could be shown
in a more positive light. And you mentioned these guys
like Steve and you and Harry Golden, which is good?
Which is which is which? Which is I really admire.
(01:02:13):
But we're still shown as subhumans. We're really shown. We're
still shown as effeminate, submissive, passive, and in my community,
we're not. We're not and that's what's not being shown.
(01:02:38):
And so our culture has to be brought out into
the open so people can see yeah, you know, and
and then some people do some people do, you know,
some people do. Uh. I remember when I was young,
(01:02:59):
people would say to me, you guys eat raw fish.
Now everybody eats raw yeah, right exactly, But it's what
kind of raw fish? Now? That's important?
Speaker 3 (01:03:12):
Right right?
Speaker 5 (01:03:13):
Yeah, you know, it's not just some fancy exotic kind
of thing. But it's the you know, it's it's the
real versus the fake. And that is always our struggle
as human beings on this earth is always what is real?
What is fake?
Speaker 1 (01:03:30):
Yeah?
Speaker 5 (01:03:32):
And I subscribe that Asian American men have a place
in this, in our story of America.
Speaker 1 (01:03:40):
You know, yes, I really appreciate you sharing your POV.
I know you started it by saying there are going
to be some people who may disagree or who find
it offensive, but you know, truly being willing to speak
out and say your experience. You have a POV that
certainly the three other people on this zoom with you
don't have. We can't we can't speak from your POV.
(01:04:02):
And so for you being willing to say it and
to share your honesty with us, Like you said, your
generation is the generation that helped propel and make these changes,
but there are still more strides that need to be
taken and that that need to happen. And so thank
you for sharing that thought with us and your perspective
with us.
Speaker 5 (01:04:22):
Yeah, I can tell you one thing. Uh you look
at what the women's movement has done. Mhmm. You can
get kicked off for show. Now if you sexually harass somebody, right,
you can get your career can be destroyed if you
if you engage in those activities. Well, in my time,
(01:04:45):
those activities were common.
Speaker 1 (01:04:48):
Yeah, it was.
Speaker 5 (01:04:49):
You had to expect it if you wanted to be
an actress, if you wanted to be successful, not only
an actress, as actress too, you have to succumb to it.
You'd have to accept this.
Speaker 1 (01:04:58):
Yeah, it was just part of the job.
Speaker 5 (01:04:59):
Yeah, part of the gig. Right, So now that's changed.
But can you stop with somebody from harassing you racially?
Speaker 1 (01:05:10):
Hm hmmm No, yeah, not yet.
Speaker 5 (01:05:14):
Not yet. So I mean, uh, maybe my my look
at life is skewed, skewed, you know, twisted, and it
is it is because going back to when I was
a kid, I was not accepted by the general public.
So my view of life is kind of skewed. Skewed. Yeah, yeah,
(01:05:36):
So I I ask you for your understanding and forgiveness
for having that kind of like view as a Yogo
d h h. But I am one h but because
of who I am, because of the race I am,
because of the class I am, I have been twisted,
(01:05:57):
so you must forgive my twisted view.
Speaker 1 (01:06:01):
Well, Keoni, we have been so honored to have you
as a part of the Boy Meets World legacy, an
actor with almost three hundred credits to his name, so
many memorable roles and projects. We really thank you very
much for spending your time and coming on the podcast
and talking with us. It was we thank you a real.
Speaker 2 (01:06:20):
Joy, amazing.
Speaker 5 (01:06:22):
Well, I am honored as well. I know about your
careers and I am very honored as well to be
accepted by you.
Speaker 1 (01:06:32):
Thank you for spending your time with us. We really
really appreciate it. And I hope it's not the last time.
Speaker 2 (01:06:37):
Hope.
Speaker 1 (01:06:37):
I hope our paths cross again. I mean, who would
have predicted that almost thirty years later, our paths would
cross here on this podcast, So I hope it's not
the last time. Thank you so much, Thank you very much.
Speaker 5 (01:06:49):
I am honored, have a wonderful day. Bye bye.
Speaker 1 (01:06:53):
What a great conversation.
Speaker 2 (01:06:55):
Yeah, amazing.
Speaker 4 (01:06:57):
Yeah, again, his career is staggering, the things that he's done.
It's just and the idea that even with that career,
he kind of it seems like he kind of still
looks at himself as almost a failure, which is straight.
Speaker 3 (01:07:11):
And you know what, he's just a journeyman. You know,
he's just like like when he calls himself an artisan
and was like, right, because you're never done, like you're
always this is about process, this is about acting, this
is about learning, like he still wants to learn new
skills and new things. That's so cool, man, What a great, healthy,
artistic perspective. You know, I'm sure it's led to a
lot of periods of you know, difficulty and feeling bad
(01:07:35):
about himself, but ultimately like he's succeeded because he it
doesn't matter what project he's in, he's always going to
be doing it, and he's always doing it one hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (01:07:42):
Like yeah, I also.
Speaker 4 (01:07:45):
At a comic con and you know, he he talks
about how he you know, he's a little disturbed by
the cult like uh, you know, stigma that that surrounds
anime and things like that. But I can also tell
you just from experience of watching him, he's so good
with his fans. I mean, it's one of those things
where he's still just so open with everybody that was
(01:08:05):
waiting in line. Again, he had a line, you know
that that's sitting there waiting to talk to him. And
so yeah, he might have that internally and he might
talk about that, but if you're a fan and you
go up to him, he's still going to show you
just the utmost respect and and you're gonna have a
great experience when you when you see him.
Speaker 1 (01:08:21):
Yeah, I know, but like will, like you said it,
it uh the the impact his families and and and
the peers of his parents, that their opinion of him
is still just so forefront of his mind that it
(01:08:42):
feels like there's a it makes me emotional to think about, Like,
you know, we look at him and his career and
we're like awe struck by all of like, Wow, look
what you've been able to do, Look what you've been
able to accomplish. And you can tell that for him,
he it does. It's it's I don't know, it just
feel if I don't know, it makes me emotional.
Speaker 3 (01:09:01):
It's interesting like me, you know, cause I've talked about
being friends with Larry Pressman, who's an older actor, and
I remember one of the first times talking to him
about people he knew, like great actors who were always
ashamed that they were an actor, and that does seem
like a generational thing, like especially for certain guys of
certain age, like you know that that were acting in
like the fifties or sixties, it felt like a cheap career,
(01:09:24):
like it felt like you were sort of avoiding a
real job by being an actor and by just being
a pretty face or you know, like there was an
inscution And I remember hearing him say that and being like,
oh wow, Like I think I had some of that too,
Like I think I was often like, well, I don't
want to just be an actor, like it just it's
something right and it's like, wait a minute, this is
an amazing thing, like that skill and the ability to
do it and like embrace it. So yeah, when I
(01:09:46):
heard him say that, I was like, oh, yeah, you're
never going to let that go that you didn't you know,
become a doctor or whatever, but in reality what you
did accomplish is insane. Yeah, Like it's so much like, yeah,
so much more rare. But I do think that nowadays
a lot of people, especially people who were listening to
something like this podcast, you think of actors or acting
as like automatically just a cool job. I think for
(01:10:08):
other generations and other contexts, it's not. It's actually like
kind of like being a Carney vaudeville like that's like this,
you know, the superficial job, this like weird thing that
you do that maybe you'll get lucky, but it's not
a real person's job.
Speaker 2 (01:10:22):
As we just lost all of our carneye fans.
Speaker 3 (01:10:26):
Sney, I think being a Carney is awesome.
Speaker 1 (01:10:29):
I know when we go on our live show and
we go on our live show tours, I'll never forget.
I don't remember where we were, but there was some
some green room that we had that was like really
not anything pleasurable, and I was like, oh man, this
green room kind of makes me sad that like this
(01:10:52):
is where we are, and writers like, I love it.
This is what we're doing.
Speaker 3 (01:10:56):
We're into some awful, disgusting room and then we make
a show.
Speaker 1 (01:11:03):
Out we do the ND.
Speaker 3 (01:11:06):
Yeah, I love it.
Speaker 1 (01:11:08):
That's a cool that's a cool way of thinking about it,
and it has changed the way I feel when I
walk into a really musty green.
Speaker 3 (01:11:17):
I kind of like it. I like they're weird and
like you got these like do you remember that one
time I couldn't find the coffee machine. It took like
twenty minutes. It was like that whole other warehouse room.
We don't know what it's for.
Speaker 1 (01:11:27):
It's like, I don't want people to think we're we're
of under selling what this I mean. I'm truly talking
about the dankest.
Speaker 2 (01:11:36):
Yeah, it's like.
Speaker 3 (01:11:37):
A lot of backstages they don't care. It's that's the
point is that you care about. You take care of
the stage, you take care of the house, the front house,
but backstage is like it's just terrible.
Speaker 1 (01:11:48):
It's just for the some some you know, bugs and
very very very bare bones. Feels like maybe an unclean
hospital space. Uh and so.
Speaker 2 (01:11:59):
Wait to do it again. Can't wait and do it again,
Carni Folk.
Speaker 1 (01:12:05):
Thank you all for listening to this episode of Podmeets World.
As always, you can follow us on Instagram pod meets
World Show. You can send us your messages, you can
send us your thoughts, your emails. Podmeets Worldshow at gmail
dot com and we've got merch.
Speaker 2 (01:12:17):
Step Bridup, buy some merch. Guess you wait, step bradup.
Speaker 1 (01:12:22):
Podmeetsworldshow dot com. We love you all, pod dismissed.
Speaker 3 (01:12:29):
Podmeets World is an iHeart podcast producer hosted by Danielle Fischel,
Wilfridell and Ryder Straw Executive producers Jensen Karp and Amy
Sugarman Executive in charge of production, Danielle Romo, producer and editor,
Tarasubash producer, Maddie Moore engineer and Boy meets World Superman
Easton out Our theme song is by Kyle Morton of Typhoon.
Follow us on Instagram at Podmets World Show, or email
(01:12:51):
us at Podmeets World Show at gmail dot com
So, I you guys know how much I love shoes.
One of my gifts from writer here is a shoe candle.
I just, I have loved shoes since I was a kid.
I loved my mom's shoes. Then when I was old
enough to start buying my own shoes, I've just I've
loved heels and Espa drills and sneakers and wedges and.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
What's an Esqua drill? I'm sorry I heard. I understood
everything else, but what's an drill?
Speaker 3 (00:48):
Is a type of poem. It's sixteen lines exactly. Doesn't
it sound like it should be.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
In a drill that drills and the screw the other direction.
It's an Espa drill.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
What what is an Espa drill? It's I'll show you
Espa drill wedges. It's like, this is a classic Espa
drill right there?
Speaker 3 (01:05):
It went away, but yeah I saw it.
Speaker 1 (01:07):
Yeah, that's an Espa drill.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
Okay, okay.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
Sometimes they sometimes they lace up around your ankle. Is
that like shoe?
Speaker 3 (01:16):
Yeah, it's a heeled sandal, kind of.
Speaker 1 (01:19):
Like a heeled sandal. Yeah, they're definitely a flat well,
I mean there's also these these are flat versions of it.
Speaker 2 (01:25):
So it's a totally different thing.
Speaker 1 (01:28):
This is so, this is what the definition is. A
flat shoe with a cloth upper, a rope sole, and
sometimes lacing that ties around the ankle, so that as
long as it has the rope bottom and a cloth top,
the shape of the shoe can be anything.
Speaker 4 (01:44):
And then it sounds like what they would have worn
on ships and stuff like rope bottom, cloth top.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
I kind of like them, are there, male? Can you
get men's esp drills?
Speaker 1 (01:56):
Yeah? I'm going to get an s P A A
U D R I L L EAT for men. Okay,
are you looking them up?
Speaker 3 (02:08):
Yeah, I'm gonna get some pirate shoes exact.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
That's what they're called.
Speaker 5 (02:11):
From now on. Those are.
Speaker 1 (02:15):
Well, there are when you love shoes, there are just
some shoes that like really give you the ick, you know,
like like say, I mean crocs used to be one
of them, for sure, before crocs became so mainstream and
in your face that everybody wore them. But even crocs
(02:38):
took me a really long time to get past. I
was like, nope, never, you could never convince to wear crocs.
But I used to feel that way about Birkenstocks.
Speaker 2 (02:50):
Oh yeah, oh gross.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
No, Well guess what. The pandemic changed many things for me. Also,
becoming a mother changed many things for me. I bought
my first pair of Crocs during the pandemic. And I
bought my first pair of Birkenstocks when Adler was little
and we were going on a vacation and I was
going to be doing a ton of walking and I
(03:15):
need support. And everyone's like, oh, once you break in
your pair of Birkenstocks, they're the You can spend fourteen
hours walking around a city in them. So I did.
I got my first pair of Birkenstocks that broke them
in greatest, most comfortable shoe, never a shoe pain. If
I'm in a pair of Birkenstocks, I can wear them
for literally twelve hours going anywhere. I walked around Austria
(03:37):
totally fine. Yesterday I put on a pair of shoes
that are so icky. Do you know the shoes that
have individual pockets for your toast?
Speaker 4 (03:53):
Oh my god, the yes rocks.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
Yes, I do.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
Okay, So I went to the gym yesterday. As you know,
very healthy lifestyle I've picked up over the last couple
of months have changed my eating habits, have started working out,
I've it has helped me, not at all. I've only
gained weight. I don't know how to explain it, but
I feel better. I do feel better, so I'm keeping
up with it. Anyway. Went to the gym yesterday to
(04:22):
do a met con class, which is a hit workout,
a high intensity interval training workout. You use weights and
you do these ten exercises. You do them three you
do them all ten of them. Then you start over
and you do them again three times. You do each
exercise for a minute. At my gym, the Poluva shoe
people were there and they were like, for this class only,
(04:42):
we are giving away free socks to anyone who would
like to try the shoes, and you can just wear
them for this class and then we'd love your honest feedback.
Tell us what you think about them. And I was like, yeah,
you know what, I'm gonna try it. Why not do
out there? Put on socks that have five daoles for
(05:04):
each of my toes, and then I put toes in
the shoes. They're freaking phenomenal.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
Not don't be that guy, bro.
Speaker 1 (05:15):
I will never ever wear them out to like run
an errand, but I am thinking about buying some for weightlifting.
I can't even believe I'm saying it. I got pictures. Look,
I need to show you guys. First of all, the
bottoms of them are so cute, like I have little
panda feet.
Speaker 3 (05:37):
So just your Wiki feet page is about to get
an update.
Speaker 1 (05:39):
And the bottom of these shoes, okay, and then look look,
look look, and they feel cool. They feel great. So
here's what I like about it.
Speaker 3 (05:49):
I'm so worried about each one of my toes. I
don't know, just stuff.
Speaker 1 (05:51):
Here's what's great. And this is what they tried to
tell me. And at first I was like, I don't
understand what you're talking about. With normal shoes and the
way our feet are in them and as thick as
they are, and with the not having individual toe brackets,
you don't actually like your toes don't really grip the ground.
All of your toes don't really grip the ground. They're
just kind of like in your shoes. With these shoes.
(06:14):
Because all of my toes were housed in their own
little home. When I would have to do something balancing,
so say I had heavy weights in my hands and
I was doing like a lunge that then where I
lifted my back foot and so I'm balancing on my
front foot. All of a sudden, all of my toes
were gripping the ground, kind of the way they do
when you're barefoot, like if you were doing yoga or
(06:35):
pilates and you're able to feel yourself and you can
like look down at your foot and realize, like, oh,
I need to put I have all my weight in
my pinky toe. I need to put more weight in
the ball on my foot. You can feel all of
that with these shoes on. They were really grippy, so
I was still able to run around on the floor.
They're hideous. They're the ugliest shoes I've ever seen in
my entire life, and I could never be seen in them.
(06:57):
But I am thinking about buying a pair.
Speaker 2 (07:00):
Would they in any way shape or form, uh like
get in.
Speaker 4 (07:06):
Like screw up your man bun if you're wearing them.
I'm curious, would they mess Would they mess with that?
Speaker 1 (07:12):
They would screw They'd screw up your macho ltte, your ice.
Speaker 2 (07:15):
I'm wondering about that, your cargo shorts and your man but.
Speaker 1 (07:18):
Your petuli is a little less.
Speaker 2 (07:20):
Potent, Okay, I'm just I'm just checking.
Speaker 1 (07:24):
Yeah, because you.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
Can still do the devil sticks though, right, that's that's.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
That's great, you can still do that. I love that anyway.
Speaker 1 (07:32):
I did think you guys would not would just not
expect me to be an ugly shoe lady.
Speaker 2 (07:37):
No, we call those douche shoes at our house.
Speaker 1 (07:40):
I love that douche.
Speaker 2 (07:41):
Yeah, we do.
Speaker 1 (07:42):
Oh, I love it so much, the douche, the douche shoes,
the douche shoe.
Speaker 2 (07:46):
So that's that's kind of what we call those. But hey,
I think you talk to me album no, to each
their own.
Speaker 4 (07:51):
I mean, that's no, it makes sense because if you
if you then have the same conversation, but around hands,
you're talking about the difference between wearing a pair of
gloves and which makes it, which does make a big difference.
Speaker 2 (08:07):
But yeah, but no, but I just you know, it
is what it.
Speaker 1 (08:11):
Is, and I do think because then I so I
left and I was like, I'm going to look these
shoes up. I'm going to see how much they are.
And I was looking at them and I did. Then
first of all, they're so so hideous on the website.
I was like, I just wore them and they didn't
look that hideous in person. On the website, I'm like,
(08:32):
they this is it couldn't possibly be this ugly. And
and I did stop myself from buying a pair because
I thought, am I ever going to be able to
get out of my own head when I'm wearing these
or the whole time? Am I going to be like
that person over there staring at my ugly feet? Shooes?
Speaker 4 (08:49):
Yeah, I don't be able to do. If you're going
to do it, you have to just jump in with No.
Speaker 1 (08:54):
You guys have single to.
Speaker 3 (09:00):
Talk you out of it.
Speaker 1 (09:01):
For weight lifting, Yeah no, No, it's good.
Speaker 4 (09:03):
I like you shouldn't define you or be stereotypical. I
do put on your broken stocks, get into your super
and go and buy the douche shoes.
Speaker 6 (09:14):
I think they'll be great. I don't see the problem.
What's no, I'm good. I'm good even with the cute
little bottom pand of feet. I'm not gonna not gonna
do it now.
Speaker 3 (09:27):
I would not judge you for shaming me. I know
I would not.
Speaker 4 (09:30):
I would not every time you put them on. He
would unabashedly shame you the whole time.
Speaker 3 (09:37):
I'm just worried about the comfort. I just whenever I
see like the idea of wrapping every one of my toes,
like exactly, that's what I mean. You don't, yeah, you know,
it seems like it wouldn't fit. Like it's just like
my toes would be too fat for one of them.
Speaker 1 (09:50):
I just need it is. It is weird because my
big toe was like a little too long for that
size of shoe, but my pinky toe was nowhere near
the end of it. So like if I went up
a different size, my would have my big toe would
have more room, but my pinky it could be cost
a mold one for you, they told me when I
said that, They said, but part of the reason your
pinky toe doesn't take up enough room is because it's
so used to being squished in your regular shoes.
Speaker 2 (10:13):
So they're pinky suffocating your petto.
Speaker 1 (10:17):
My pinky toe has shrunk itself in order to fit
into the fabric of this society.
Speaker 3 (10:21):
And if I could, in order to appeal to people
like you who call her douche shoes, if she likes
the wrong shoes.
Speaker 1 (10:28):
My pinky could have its own identity.
Speaker 2 (10:30):
You do you it doesn't? You go out there and
you bet the bottom shoes bag you can.
Speaker 3 (10:36):
That's how I look at it. Be in a douchebag.
It's it's it's wearing what you want. Wear that hair bun.
Speaker 2 (10:42):
Of course, wear that hair bun.
Speaker 1 (10:45):
Neglect your feet. If you guys want your pinky toes
to continue to shrink themselves to fit into society.
Speaker 3 (10:50):
I am I'm totally are you? Are you well? Because
you know I don't have beach shoes. I hate anything
that actually shows my feet. This is perfect. These are
beachy shoes that I can wear. They're like sandals, but
I don't have to Actually, you know, one has to
look at my hobby feet.
Speaker 1 (11:05):
It's perfect. Will you update us when you get your
male espadral? Yeah, okay, thank you. Welcome to Pod meets World.
Speaker 2 (11:12):
I'm Daniel Fishl, I'm right or Strong, and I'm Will Fordell.
Speaker 1 (11:27):
If we've said it once, we've said it a million times.
For the most part, we were pretty self absorbed as
kids on the set of Boy Meets World. The sheer
number of adult actors Will could have talked to about
their time on MASH or the stories Bill could have
told us about the making of the graduate, or the
moments I could have at least remembered from the run
of the show. They all seem like missed opportunities that
(11:47):
now with a rewatch podcast three decades later, we can
right those wrongs and not only shine a spotlight on
some of these incredible talents that joined us on set,
but we can learn more about them, even if a
little late. And this week we get to right our
wrongs once again. With a career spanning over fifty years,
our guest this week has two hundred and eighty one
acting credits to his name. You may have seen him
(12:08):
steal scenes on the genius HBO show Deadwood, or appear
in movies like Men in Black three and the adrenaline
laced cult hit Crank, or on TV where he kicked
off his career with appearances on shows like Different Strokes,
Heart to Heart, Saint Elsewhere, and Webster. He's the absolute
definition of a working actor, still acting and making a
killing as one of the most prolific voice actors working today,
(12:32):
with classics like Narudo, Gi Joe, Samurai Jack, Teen Titans,
and Avatar The Last Airbender. On a long, long resume.
Speaker 5 (12:41):
He's awesome, He's awesome.
Speaker 3 (12:44):
Yeah, Yeah, Avatar the Last Mayorbender is one of those
classes I've never watched.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
Everyone just in Gi Joe.
Speaker 1 (12:49):
I mean, come on, yeah, But for some reason, and
we don't know why, he's agreed to join us this
week to talk about the one time he played a
professor at Penbrook University dealing with a group of bright
eyed freshmen on our Meager family sitcom for season six's
Ain't College Great? This week we're talking to one of
the most impressive guest stars we have ever had. Please
(13:10):
welcome keone Young.
Speaker 5 (13:15):
Hello.
Speaker 1 (13:16):
Thank you so much for joining us. We are honored
that you would share some of your time with us
to talk about your very prolific career. Just trying to
get your first credit on IMDb takes several minutes. Yes,
so you were raised in Hawaii. Both of your parents
had immigrated to the United States. Your father Chinese.
Speaker 5 (13:39):
No, actually they didn't immigrant. They were born in Hawaii, Okaya.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
Tell us about your upbringing.
Speaker 5 (13:47):
I'm a third generation from My grandfather was from China.
My grandmother and grand father on my mother's side was
from Japan. But my parents were born in Honolulu, hoois Okay.
Speaker 1 (14:01):
And so what was their reaction when you decided to
pursue a career in the entertainment industry.
Speaker 5 (14:09):
Well, I have to tell you that. You know, for
Asians who emigrated to this country, they came as agricultural people.
They came as peasants. My grandparents worked in the fields
you know of in the sugarcane and pineapple fields, and
(14:29):
that's where Hawaii became very commercially, very viable for the
United States because they provided a lot of sugar for
the country. So my grandparents were indentured workers to plantations.
So my grandfather and grandmother wanted their my grandparents wanted
(14:54):
their kids to be educated. So my my parents were
were the first to go to school, finish high school
and from from there where they fed kind of like
this new workforce during the fifties through the Eisenhower years,
the post war years. Their dream was for their kids
(15:16):
to become doctors, lawyers, or even a dentist. Yeah, that
was the lowest acceptable. Let you do that. That was acceptable.
And you know, I just I was really a bad student,
(15:41):
and you know, having kids myself, I realized that school.
You know, my son told me I want to quit
school at third grade and I said why and he said, well,
school kills my creativity. And I couldn't argue that with him,
because they did that for me, because I come from
(16:02):
school in the sixties where everything was you know, you
by wrote, there's no creativity at all. You know, you
had to memorize your multiplication tables. You had to memorize
all your science for me, you know, and I just
I couldn't. My brain didn't function that way. And so
I was a real bad student. So I was considered
(16:24):
what we call in Japanese yogo day, which means dirty,
you know, the filthy part of life, A person who
is scum actually so and I mean scum, I mean
the residue of the bottom side of society. And I
(16:45):
found and because I was regarded as such, you know,
my my friends, my friend's parents would say, oh, don't,
don't play with him, don't, don't, you know, because he's
he's no good. So I found a family in the theater.
I wanted to work in theater. I wanted to actually
(17:09):
I want to build sets. I wanted to design lights.
I hung lights. I was I was a kid, I
was like fourteen fifteen. I wasn't afraid to go up
into the to the fly they call it, fly and
hang lights. And I was mentored by some good technical people,
you know, and as I was in. I was in
(17:32):
the Humblu Community Theater. There is a long story. I
hope you have the time we do so. In the
Hullelo Community Community Theater, I'd be from up in the flies.
I'd be watching actors and I thought I'd be thinking,
they're not that good.
Speaker 1 (17:51):
I don't like what they're doing.
Speaker 5 (17:53):
Now It's not I didn't like. I just thought, well,
I don't believe them, you know. Yeah, and I and
of course a lot of the actors during that time,
they didn't want to do small parts, you know. So
directors would come up to me and go, hey, kid,
we need a waiter in the scene to come in
and take an order. Would you do it? So while
(18:14):
moving the sets and you know, doing the lights, I'd go,
I'd say okay, and I'd do it one line. And
I did a lot of great plays. I was in
the Death of a Salesman. I played the waiter and
Death of a Salesman. Right, come in and I say,
can I take your order, sir? One a cup of coabi?
Thank you. But but what forced me then was I'd
(18:37):
be able to watch a play like Arthur Miller's Death
of a Salesman and and gain benefits from it. Realize,
you know, school was important, but this is life drama
and this, you know. I watched, you know, and then
I would meet young people from New York who would say, hey,
(19:00):
read Tennessee Williams read, Edward Alby read Chekhov. And I
would go up into the They had this little library
in the theater and i'd sit there and i'd work
as a janitor there too, just to you know, pay
for classes and whatever. And I'd read all these wonderful plays.
(19:25):
I read out Edward Alby the Zoo Story, and I
was like, wow, this is fantastic. So I got inspired
to the theater. And also, if you know musicals, you
know there's a lot of chorus parts where people would
would sing and dance, and I was oftentimes they actors
(19:51):
didn't want to be in these chorus parts, so they'd
throw me in there because I had a bass voice.
And it was really funny because at fourteen and fifteen,
there was a young woman who was a year older
than me, who was in sort of the same position,
who kind of like befriended me and who showed me
(20:12):
how kind theater people were to me. They didn't judge
me if I didn't have the credentials like being a doctor,
a lawyer of four point oh you know, yeah, student,
and she we kind of like I did My Fair
Lady with her, and it was really funny because you know,
(20:34):
I spoke to local patois. But then I had to
learn how to relearn how to speak standard stage speech,
and you know, so I'm getting married in the morning,
I'd have to learn cognitia yes, and did how to
succeed in business without really trying. And she became she
(20:54):
was like, you know, like just a not a really
good We had these good looking women stars in there,
you know, and they would always kind of like, oh,
treat her like very patronizing to her. But she was
a very beautiful person and very beautiful voice. So at eighteen,
(21:15):
and I was seventeen, she said, I'm going to New
York study become an actress, which kind of inspired me.
I didn't have enough money to go to New York,
so I had enough money to go to California. Yeah,
I came to California. I had four hundred dollars in
my pocket. And that lady was Bet Middler, by the way,
Oh yeah, she became Bet Middler. So I said, Wow,
(21:41):
that's nice. You know that it could happen to someone
who I grew up with, that's amazing. And so that's
the story. I came to LA. I had four hundred
dollars in my pocket, two pairs of pants, two pairs
of shirts, I mean a pair of shirts. And so.
Speaker 1 (22:01):
Where did you live? Did you have a roommate? Where?
How did you find a place to stay?
Speaker 5 (22:06):
Well, I applied my mother, being the Asian mother, applied
to several colleges, which all rejected me because my GPA.
But Pasadena Playoffs took me amazing. It was a college
of theater arts back in the sixties. It was very
famous at that time. Gene Hackman went there, Dustin Hoffman
(22:30):
went there. So they accepted me. I worked during the
summer to pay for the fee, and I didn't know
they needed the money really bade so they took a
lot of people. Yeah, and I went to people like
in my class were Stally Struthers from you know father
(22:53):
that three company.
Speaker 2 (22:55):
Oh, No, Sally from from from all in the family.
Speaker 5 (22:58):
All in the family. Yeah. And I don't know if
you know Ben Murphy, he was in Alias Smith and Jones.
He was so anyway, So I studied there for two
years and I was able to survive it and graduate,
and I found out, oh, this is an interesting thing
(23:22):
I was looking. I was. I worked during its school
in the library, and I came across past students at
East at Pastina playoffs, and I'd see names like Dustin Hoffman,
Gene Hackman went there, and it inspired me. And then
(23:43):
I saw this picture of this Asian guy because I
thought I was the first Asian guy that went to
Pasadena Playhouse, but there was another guy there and his
name was Maco, and I found out he was nominated
for Academy Award for San Pebbles. Consequently, he was nominated
for a Tony even Somendheims Pacific Overtures, And so I said, wow,
(24:05):
that's inspirational. So I've been having all these as a
failure that I was as a person, you know, according
to my status in life, I was fortunate to have
all these experiences and these moments of like inspiration. So
I said, wow, he got nominated for an Academy Award
with Steve McQueen and Candy Bergen, and so I, you know,
(24:32):
I was motivated. And then I came to La and
I met him. I found him and he had founded
a theater called the East West Players, and I had
been a member there. And his philosophy was like, actors
have to learn everything, not just because acting is like
(24:53):
is not a defined science, you know, where one method
is a correct answer to any every situation. He would say,
actors have to learn the sciences that surround acting, which
is dance, music. So he sent me to New York
in seventy six, and he told me go to New
(25:15):
York and study because LA is full of Hollywood actors.
He said, they don't know nothing. So I went to
New York. I studied, you know, method Gratowski. I studied ballet.
I went to opera. I studied modern dance. You know,
everything I studied, I learned through music theory. I learned
(25:38):
to play an instrument. I learned about classical music, Western
and Asian. I went to Berlitz. I studied languages. So
he made he forced me to study, and he was
He went to do Pacific overtures for some time at
that time in seventy six, and he kind of funded me.
(25:58):
You know, yeah, I mean I had to borrow two
thousand from my screen actors. Guild Credit Union as well
in order to live. So I have to thank the
Credit Union for funding my education at that time. So
I was on there on my own. I lived at
the YMCA, and I've been studying ever since. Studying is
(26:21):
just part of being an actor. I study today, I
have classes today, I study.
Speaker 4 (26:25):
It is so incredible and Maco is I mean, forget
being hugely important to me for my favorite show of
all time, mash where he must have played eight or
nine different characters, but Conan, his role in Conan the
Barbarian and ConA the Destroyer, like helped to define me
as a kid.
Speaker 5 (26:43):
They were sicking.
Speaker 4 (26:45):
Well, yeah, because I mean I'm a fantasy nerd. And
he was one of the first quote unquote wizards I
ever saw, because he played a sorcerer and a wizard
in Conan. And I think I was eight or nine
when it came out and it was just awe inspiring.
Speaker 2 (26:58):
So yeah, he was alleged.
Speaker 5 (27:00):
Can I tell you a little funny story about Conan,
please please, Well what had happened was Arnold had hired
One of his requirements was that the director had to
hire all his buddies so Arnold could train with them.
While he was there in Spain, and one director hired
(27:22):
them to play all these warriors and muscle. Uh, these
these bad guys. Well, one thing that they did was
they developed every muscle in their body except one muscle,
and that was the voice musk, the throat muscle. So
they all came talking like this.
Speaker 2 (27:45):
The way it was John Millis, John Milias.
Speaker 5 (27:49):
So I had a meeting with John, you know, and
John said I can't have this because they were all time,
I will kill you. And John was this kind of
like Asiano file who loved Kurosawa, you know, I don't
know if you know. He did the Seventh Summarise and
me fooney and all that. So John said, I'm going
(28:10):
to play this movie the scene, this battle scene, and
this is how I want the battle scene to sound. Well,
Maco had introduced me to John and said, John, hire
this kid. And so I said, John, you don't have
to run. I used to watch that on my grandmother's lap.
So I know the movie backwards and forwards. I know
the sound that you want. So I recreated all these
(28:32):
Samurai voices, you know, for John. So I replaced all
these muscle men and made men out of them cool,
and that was in Conan Barbarian and that kind of
like was a trajectory for me and my If you've
seen my IMDb, I've done a lot of voice work. Yeah,
(28:52):
that was a trajectory for me to start working in
voice because I said, Wow, I don't have to I
can wear my pajamas exactly, get up and walk to
I don't don't have to worry about, you know, having
these two hour early calls before I hit the set.
Speaker 2 (29:08):
With the makeup makeup man.
Speaker 5 (29:12):
So yeah, so that's my con end story.
Speaker 1 (29:26):
Let's jump into your TV career a little bit. You
began your career on shows like Room two twenty two
and Kojak and movies like Private Benjamin. But I think
most of our audience may have first seen you on
different strokes, So I wanted to talk to you about
that experience and but also the kinds of roles you
were auditioning for as an Asian American.
Speaker 5 (29:48):
Well, let me just say this to you quite frankly,
that Asian Americans are not seen as Americans. Of my
roles has been as a foreigner, right, so, which was
really difficult for for many of us because when we
(30:09):
were growing up our parents said, no, you're American, don't
speak our language. So you know, it was a kind
of like a contradiction. Here I was in Hollywood, and
I realized that shortly. I said, Wow, they only see
me as a foreigner. But I speak English, and I
(30:30):
can speak English better than a lot of English. So
so different strokes. So I had to learn to adjust.
I had to learn to learn other people's cultures, which
I was fortunate because I was in Hawaiian and it
was multicultural. You know. We grew up with Japanese, Chinese, Koreans, Filipinos, Vietnamese,
(30:56):
Portuguese and so on, so I kind of learned the culture.
So different strokes was interesting. You know. At night I
would be doing Ibsen and Tennessee Williams, like I said, Albi,
and then in the day I would be doing stuff
like different strokes and Golden Girls and stuff like that,
(31:18):
and I was kind of weighing what is most important
to me, you know. I was doing regional theater. I
went to Milwaukee, I went to New Hampshire. I was
traveling around the country working for peanuts. And then I
would do these TV shows and make incredible amounts of money,
and I just could not understand it, the contributions. So
(31:43):
what I found out though, was that when people were
working in Hollywood, and particularly in TV, and particularly in
three camera comedy, people were very anxious about their longevity
and their life. Yeah, people always worried and scared, particularly
the adults, whether they were going to get canceled, what
(32:05):
their ratings were, where they were going to live, where
their character was going to die, whether they were whether
the writer, producer, runner of the show was happy with them,
you know, because if they weren't, they might be written
out of the show, or they not enough dialogue. So
I said, well, it's good. I'm I can't you know,
(32:28):
I'm I'm just a guest there, and I'll be a
guest everywhere I go. I'll never be a part of
this infrastructure, you know, I'll never be part of that society.
Number One, they wouldn't allow us in unlike today you
might see more of us because we fought for that.
But I said, you know, I cannot rely on these people.
(32:50):
I just have to do my own thing. So I
was never worried about being fired, or being a band
or being how would you say an outcast? I mean,
I just did my thing. And I guess there was
some smart enough people to realize, Yeah, that guy knows
(33:15):
m he's always on time, he always knows his lines,
he always hits his mart get them, yeah, you know,
And I realized that I would spend more time being
proficient and efficient as opposed to trying to get somebody
to love me.
Speaker 1 (33:33):
Right.
Speaker 5 (33:34):
So, I don't know, I really I really felt a contradiction.
You know. I was happy doing this show, but as
I watched the kids around me, I was kind of
sad at the same time, if you know what I mean.
And it was very sad because I felt no one's
(33:58):
really educating the young people about the potential of their potential,
you know. And consequently what happened was proved to be true.
I loved working with the old timers. Conrad Bain was
a wonderful gentleman who came from theater and he could
(34:21):
understand me, and so we kind of bonded there and
it was it was enjoyable. I'll say one other thing,
like like Golden Girls. Golden Girls, everybody would warn me
about be Arthur. Yeah, they say, oh, you got to
watch out for her. She suffers the fools. Well, she
doesn't but she does appreciate actors who are serious. And
(34:47):
when I did the scene with her, it was it
was delightful because she was she was good.
Speaker 2 (34:53):
Oh yeah, one of the best ever on television.
Speaker 5 (34:57):
I think, so. I mean she was. She was very good,
very professional, and she was a fellow I don't want
to say the word artists. I never refer to myself
as one a fellow artisan, you know, very craft. She
was respected the craft, and that's what I really loved
(35:19):
about her.
Speaker 1 (35:20):
Well, you would go on to appear on literal classic
TV shows like Taxi, The Jefferson's, Cheers, and Saint Elsewhere,
alongside our pwell William Daniels. Yeah, did you ever feel like,
you know, that sense you had as a kid that
you weren't going to amount to much because you weren't
(35:41):
the traditional good student. Did you ever feel like you
were making it moving here from Hawaii and booking so
much incredible work?
Speaker 5 (35:49):
No? No, wow, Because you know, my mother's friends, their
sons were doctors and lawyers and very very wealthy, very established,
and my mom was very impressed because they grew up
in the Eisenhower days, they grew up the Rockefeller days,
they grew up in the how to influence people, you know,
(36:13):
with your magnanimity. They would love Donald Trump today because
he was wealthy, and that would be the criteria. I'm me,
I'm presuming, yeah, But I tell you one time I
did I did. I did a movie The Week with
(36:36):
Karen Allen and it was about the Challenger Shuttle. You
remember the shuttle that carsonal So I played one of
the astronauts, Elison on a Zuka who was on the
flight at that time. And I went home and in
Hawaii and finally my mom was kind of proud of me.
(37:00):
And then but then she would go around to her
friends going like, well, you know where he got his
talent from?
Speaker 2 (37:09):
So taking credit, no praise, but taking credit.
Speaker 5 (37:11):
Wow, well you know because I was, you know, when
high school, I was, you.
Speaker 1 (37:16):
Know, in a play in a play.
Speaker 5 (37:19):
Wow, So I really you know, it was it was
kind of funny. But when my dad asked me how
much money I made, and I made a lot of money,
as you can imagine, he just he would not believe
me because what I made in a week he made
in a year. So they all kind of like in
(37:40):
the final decades kind of like was proud, but they
were proud because I was part of the family.
Speaker 4 (37:48):
You know, I have to ask about the about the
the the movie of the week was Karen Allen, Krista mccaulloff.
Speaker 5 (37:55):
Yeah, okay, and Barry Bostwick was in it, you know, man,
Peter Boy was in it. It was it was a
fun project. Yeah. Wow.
Speaker 1 (38:07):
Let's get into your time on Boy Meets World. Do
you remember the audition for the role of Professor?
Speaker 5 (38:15):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (38:16):
Yeah, And what was that like?
Speaker 5 (38:20):
It was like any other job. You know, I've going
on auditions for all kinds of stuff. So if if
you know the role, I mean it was just gibberish, right,
and so I just didn't get gibberish.
Speaker 1 (38:36):
We talked about it when we recapped the episode, because
you say it was just gibberish, as if doing gibberish
is actually easy. It is not. We all like practiced
on the day we recapture episode.
Speaker 2 (38:53):
And none of us could do it.
Speaker 1 (38:54):
None of us could even come close.
Speaker 3 (38:56):
It's one of those things that conceptually, like even if
you wrote it, you'd be like, oh, that'll be funny,
but to actually deliver it and sell it is really difficult.
Speaker 5 (39:04):
Well, you know, sound is as important as words. You know.
That's what I was taught from my mentor Macco. He says,
sound tells you the truth, and just you go back
on this tape and listen to yourselves. How much sound
you just said? Hmm, And it has subtext to it.
(39:27):
So sound is very important. When we're singing opera, we're
singing Italian and like, I don't know what it means, right,
you know, when I'm singing German, I'm singing Ontie music
and Schubert's under music to hold the kunsin vivel gauen Stunden.
I don't know what the actual meaning is. I've since learned,
(39:52):
but while I'm singing it, I'm kind of like thinking
of the German you know, at that time, and you
know the music of Bach and and sound is really important.
So sound was not a problem with me because I
grew up in a country or a state that sound.
(40:15):
You know. I would hear the Filipinos speaking and the
Koreans speaking, and their sounds were, for example, like Chinese
would in a moment of expression, they would say ah yeah, uh,
Koreans would uh. Koreans would say aigh. Philippines with withoud
(40:36):
Filipino you would say, oh no, and in Japanese you
would say, ah yah. They are all sounds, and there's
sounds that relate to what you feel, deep feelings that
you feel. So sound was not difficult for me. What
was difficult was, you know, when you do three camera,
(40:58):
I'm really talking a lot. I don't know why, because
maybe because.
Speaker 1 (41:01):
That's wanted to talk to you.
Speaker 5 (41:07):
Usually I don't spend that much time explaining. But with
other actors, I think you guys could understand it, really sure.
But when you when you're working in three camera comedy
and you know, I work with guys like Bud Yorkin
and Norman Lear and those guys, and it was brutal,
bruialty No, but it was brutal because Bud would come down,
(41:30):
you know, after you have a run through and he'd
watched run through, he'd come down with a martini with
his guys and they would sit there and criticize. And
you know, these guys were not they were not theater people.
They didn't you know, they were just they wanted the laugh,
they wanted the moment of response. They wanted results, well,
(41:55):
results in terms of the scene, in terms of acting.
They wanted results and Wow, I was not that. I
was the type of actor where I bet, like you know,
we loved Brando, you know, like searching and wondering and
you know that was our kind of like hero when
when I was a kid, and and James Dean and
(42:19):
we try to find the moment of the scene, and
they weren't interested in the moment of the scene. They
wanted to laugh, you know. It was rhythm.
Speaker 1 (42:25):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (42:26):
So I when you say the audition I just I
mean the gibberish part wasn't the problem of it was.
It was. It was the results and what the showrunner wanted.
Speaker 1 (42:46):
So when so you get the job, you come, you come.
You're on set with us during that week. What do
you remember that week about the rehearsal process taping, because,
like you mentioned, we had a showrunner that would come
down after, you know, run through and give very long notes.
What was your experience that week.
Speaker 5 (43:03):
Well, for the young people, I really liked them. They
were very respectful to me, you know, and I liked
all the young people.
Speaker 1 (43:12):
That would have been us.
Speaker 5 (43:16):
Yeah, I mean they were very supportive and friendly to me.
They would bring up shows movies that they had seen
me and you know, yeah, and we talked. The older
people were always like nervous, particularly with the showrunner, you know,
like is he upset? Is he mad? Did he think
I was funny? And I was going, well, that's not
(43:38):
a way to live a life for me anyway. And
so I was like on my tiptoes, you know, like
trying to like be careful, like just be careful that
I would make it through the week at my check
and then go on to do other things. I don't
know if you talk to the woman that kind of
(44:00):
like talk to me about this show, And I said,
it was not a really great experience for me. So
I don't know why they want to talk to me.
Speaker 1 (44:07):
We want to hear your experience good, bad, We want
to hear it all.
Speaker 5 (44:12):
Well, like I said, the showrunner was you know, pretty alpha,
pretty dominating.
Speaker 3 (44:17):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (44:18):
And I understood the necessity of it. I understood the
importance of that. I mean I had worked in many
many shows where like I said, I worked for Dorm
Bud yorkin you know, and Bud was doing the Red
Fox show and read banned him from the set and
read and he said, but Red, I owned the show,
(44:40):
and read, I don't care. I'm not coming to the
set if you're there. And ABC had called up Bud
York and had said, don't go down to the set, So,
you know, you have that kind of conflict and contradiction,
and I just I was like, not intimidated, but I
didn't want to be around that kind of you know,
(45:01):
and every three camera comedy I had seen it, you know, yeah,
and where the showrunner is the boss and there's no
way to have a conversation about it. You know, you
do what you're told or you're done. So my job
was just doing what I was told. That was it.
Speaker 1 (45:24):
Yep, get in, do it like this and leave, take
your shot, and then go do something that actually fills
your soul.
Speaker 5 (45:32):
Well yeah, but I enjoyed the people on the show.
There was one writer who can't remember his name, but
he was very kind, and like I said, the young
people were very fun to be with.
Speaker 1 (45:46):
Yeah. Yeah, well good, I'm glad. I'm glad at least
we were fun to be around.
Speaker 5 (45:52):
Yeah, I mean, I'm glad I was done with it.
Speaker 1 (45:54):
Yeah, yeah, you got to leave. Did you ever watch
the shows when they aired? Did you see your boy
Meets were all episode when it aired on TV?
Speaker 5 (46:01):
Eventually, I only watched it recently, really told me to
watch it.
Speaker 1 (46:07):
Yeah, what did you? What were your thoughts on it?
Speaker 5 (46:09):
Now?
Speaker 1 (46:10):
What were your thoughts watching it?
Speaker 5 (46:14):
I was terrible? You know how you think that we
as actors, you know, you always look at yourself. I
could have done that. I could. Of course, I should
have did this. I should have done it. You know,
I could have been better, which has always been my mantra.
You know, I can be better. I should be better.
You know. So such an actor thing.
Speaker 4 (46:35):
It's such an actor thing too, your Monday morning quarterback,
your own performance all the time. And oh if I
could just have given it a shot, if I could
do it one more time, I would have done this.
But the truth of the matter is, then if you
watched it a third time, you'd want to change the.
Speaker 2 (46:48):
Thing you just did again.
Speaker 3 (46:49):
It would it would never be.
Speaker 2 (46:51):
Perfect, no matter what you think.
Speaker 5 (46:53):
Yeah, yeah, but.
Speaker 1 (46:55):
We absolutely loved you in it.
Speaker 5 (46:59):
Yeah, thank you.
Speaker 1 (47:00):
Hysterical so funny, absolutely nailed it, laugh out loud funny,
I mean, truly sparked an entire discussion for us about
how much harder what you are doing, how much harder
it is than it looks it looks like? How I
mean you make it look seamless and effortless, and then
all of us, with effort, could not come close to it.
(47:20):
So truly, we also wanted to talk Deadwood with you,
where you played mister wu. This was a magical show
created by David Milch that even with all the acclaim
it did get deserved even more. Do you consider this
maybe the best thing you've ever done? And if not,
what do you think is the best thing you've ever done?
Speaker 5 (47:42):
Well? Yes, I was very fortunate to meet David Milch.
You know, oftentimes, like I said, people see us as foreigners.
Well we are in a sense, at least my grandparents were,
and I've always wanted the opportunity to show them, not
to glorify them, but to show them that they had
(48:05):
desires and passions too, And David Milt was open to that.
It's kind of character that I've I am and I've
always wanted to develop and he did too. So and
he did that with every character. You know, he did
(48:25):
that with every character. Find out get the essence of
what that character represented, what his dreams were, what his
failures were, and his inner dialogue, what we really thought
about the situation. It was just grand You know, just
to be on the set to work with as great actors.
(48:48):
I don't know about you, but you know, like that
old joke about when you look at a script you
go to my line, my line both, well, we would
like I would come down to the set just to
watch people act. Wow, yeah, and just watch scene. Billy sorry,
(49:11):
I can't think of his name. William Anderson, Billy Anderson.
He was in that Bob Newhart show. He was one
of the brothers. He played. Yeah. Uh, he played the
mayor of Deadwood, and he is such a great actor.
I would just go down to the set just to
watch him act. Uh. And it was just wonderful. It
(49:33):
was like being in school, you know, like being like
an actors studio where you go and watch somebody scene
and you'd learn from that, and Milts would come down
and explain to you what the scene was about and
how stupid you were, and you, you don't know. The
great feeling it is when somebody as smart as David
Milt comes up to you and go, that was stupid,
(49:59):
you know, And he goes, you know what I'm trying
to say, right, you know what I mean? Right? And
I go, yeah, I know what you mean. David, and
then we would go back and work it out. And
David was the kind of guy. He was great. I mean,
he feared nobody. You know, he'd go, we'd be on
season episode three and he go, he'd watch episode three
(50:20):
the scene and go, you know that scene in episode one,
I want to rewrite it. He took the producers and
he go, I think that I could make that scene better.
And they go, David, we have to rehire all those actors,
build a set, and he goes, I don't care to
(50:42):
do it because it will make me better. And I
think that's why HBO kind of like canceled it, because
it was it was an expensive show because of how
David wanted to do this show, and that's when TV
can be. It's yeah, I think, I think, I think,
(51:04):
you know, but.
Speaker 2 (51:05):
I mean watching it was it was. I remember the
first time, the first couple episodes, it hit me.
Speaker 4 (51:10):
I was like, oh, this is this is how Shakespeare
would do a Western.
Speaker 2 (51:16):
I mean it was it was that level.
Speaker 4 (51:17):
It was literally Shakespearean with the characters and there, I
mean there. It was amazing it what it did for television,
but also for the Western, where it was just such
on a different level all the way around.
Speaker 2 (51:29):
It was truly just one of the most magical things
that I think has ever been on television.
Speaker 4 (51:34):
And I know people would think that's that's a bold statement,
but I truly think it's deserving of that statement. It
is was magical. It really was lightning in a bottle.
It was all the ridiculous platitudes you hear about something
wonderful that was fleeting was Deadwood.
Speaker 2 (51:50):
It was incredible.
Speaker 5 (51:52):
Well, let me ask you this question, then, do you
think that every Western since Deadwood on TV? Successful successful
Western has been influenced by Deadwood?
Speaker 4 (52:02):
Oh?
Speaker 5 (52:03):
Absolutely, absolutely? Do you think not? I do. I read
an article recently that said every Western that has followed
dead Deadwood has something to be thankful for from.
Speaker 1 (52:18):
In some way Deadwood.
Speaker 2 (52:20):
Yeah, that's amazing.
Speaker 5 (52:22):
The struggle that we had, the challenge that we had
as actors was great because where in TV does a
challenge you to to surpass your present state and become
something greater. Where where in TV does that? You know?
(52:46):
And I find that that has carried me in my career.
I just recently did a a series with Jessica Bielle
in New York and it was one of the first
times I felt as an actor that I was complete,
(53:07):
that I had my own identity, that my identity was
not fined for you by the writer or the director,
or the or the producer, but that I had felt
that I had my own identity as the character, and
I had established it. And I guess that's what Deadwood
(53:32):
has allowed me to do, was to come onto every
project to be able to say, Okay, let me give
a dimension to this that is not just two dimensional
or four dimensional. Let me be more abstract, let me
let me uncover the character, and consequently, wow, that seems
(53:56):
to work for me. Which what I learned from Deadwood
that you're much more than the printed page is two dimensional? Right?
You read it on the page, You read on the
page eight times, and you think, oh, what can make
this work? Why? Right? Right? And you find it? And
so that pushed by David Mills, is find the character.
(54:20):
Don't be stupid, don't take the least common denominator, take
the highest common denominate, yes on the other extra spectrum
and challenge you as an actor. And I guess that's
what Didwood did. And I was very fortunate. I'm so
fortunate that I was to meet somebody like David Milch.
Speaker 1 (54:52):
I won't talk about all the video games that you
have worked on because those companies have to pay your
union first. But in animated product Jax, you voiced Naruto Avatar,
The Last Airbender, High High, Puffy on the Yumi Batman,
and now Gremlin's The Secrets of Maguai. All of these
projects have had huge spikes in popularity over the past
few years. Are you surprised by the mainstreaming of anime
(55:16):
and animated shows?
Speaker 5 (55:18):
No, let me tell you what I'm surprised about. That
is young people's devotion to it. Yeah, and I wish
it wasn't so much so, because they're obviously looking for
an outlet that relieves them from anxiety and pressures. And
(55:43):
I go to all these I'm invited to a lot
of comic cons Yeah, and I see young people just uh,
throwing themselves into that kind of like a cult of anime,
understanding what that anime means. In Japan, it's the same thing,
(56:07):
you know, you know in Japan. You know, Japan is
a very controlled society in terms of behavior and in
terms of how you relate to each other, in terms
of not only personal relationship, but in class relationship. There's
forms of language that you must speak if you're talking
(56:28):
to someone older than you, superior to you. And there's
a way to talk to somebody who's beneath you. In Japanese,
you know, to cuss somebody out, there's no real cuss words.
Is the word you and the different forms of you.
(56:50):
So I can have a formal way of saying you,
or I can have an informal way, and the way
you use it to somebody determines your really, So what
I'm trying to say is Japan has very control society
and they let their emotions out by watching all this
man manga and you know, you say, wow, they have
(57:10):
so much violence in their things. Well yeah, but that's
the one way what they use in order not to
commit violence. Yeah, but in America, kids are really like
put so much equity in these things. And it doesn't
(57:34):
bother me, but I just wish I could sit down
with them and say, oh, hey, you know why you're
doing this right? Yeah, you know, you know why. And
Star Wars has been becoming a cult as well, you know,
and it's fine, you should love these things, but you
should love them in terms of how that relates to
(57:55):
your life, that what you want to do with your
life and what you want how you want to be
progressive to progress. So when you say, am I surprised, No,
I'm not surprised because we live in a cult kind
of world right now. Well, we're not thinking for ourselves,
you know, we're not looking at factual evidence and heroes.
(58:22):
Heroes are not going to save our day for us ourselves.
And so it really bothers me that about this kind
of implosion of anime and manga. And you know, I mean,
it's it's great. We have cartoons. There's some really great
you know, like I don't know if you know the
(58:43):
history of like comics like Will Eisner who was uh,
who was a great great UH novelist, comic book novelist.
He wrote about the strugg of the Jews in the
Lower East Side during the Depression and uh, And that's
(59:07):
what I find kind of missing sometimes.
Speaker 1 (59:12):
Wow. Well, we talked we talked a little bit about
this with Stephen Park when he was on the podcast.
But obviously you have witnessed a total evolution of opportunities
for Asian actors in Hollywood. What are your feelings when
you see actors like Stephen Youn or Henry Golding starring
in massive movies without any signifying mark about their race.
Speaker 5 (59:36):
It's good, it's good. But you know in plays I've
done Gibson, I've done Chekhov, you know, I've done a
lot of and I think I laid that found is
my generation that kind of laid the foundation for them
thinking where they could go.
Speaker 1 (59:55):
Yes, sure, for sure.
Speaker 5 (59:57):
You know the generation before me, which was the first
generation that was with like people like Richard lou Kee Luke,
that generation. I'm the second generation. They were kind of
like immigrants and kind of fulfilling the role of being
the Asian you know, the Fu Manchu or the Asian
(01:00:18):
stereotype for what America needed in terms of like a
growing as a as a first world They needed to
picture the enemy properly for people, you know. And so
we came up and said, hey, you know, we're Americans too,
So we wanted so and theater was our outlet because
(01:00:41):
like I said, I think I said of the characters
I played in Foreigners, and to see that change now
is very is very good. It's what we've worked for
as a community of Asian American performers in this country.
Don't forget that we got reparations for when Japanese Americans
(01:01:04):
were interned during the war. We got reparations from the
an apology from Ronald Reagan. So that l Mark was
very important for us because it showed, hey, we are
humans too, which consequently transferring itself to a lot of writers, novelists.
(01:01:31):
You know who wrote Crazy Rich Asians and who wrote
all these books and Maxine Hank Kingston and Amy Tanned
they wrote all these novels and then movies were made
from them, which is really good. But I just have
one question, one point of view that you might not
(01:01:51):
agree with me, and I'm sure it will offend a
lot of people that Asian men are still shown uh
yeh in a non positive light. It could be shown
in a more positive light. And you mentioned these guys
like Steve and you and Harry Golden, which is good?
Which is which is which? Which is I really admire.
(01:02:13):
But we're still shown as subhumans. We're really shown. We're
still shown as effeminate, submissive, passive, and in my community,
we're not. We're not and that's what's not being shown.
(01:02:38):
And so our culture has to be brought out into
the open so people can see yeah, you know, and
and then some people do some people do, you know,
some people do. Uh. I remember when I was young,
(01:02:59):
people would say to me, you guys eat raw fish.
Now everybody eats raw yeah, right exactly, But it's what
kind of raw fish? Now? That's important?
Speaker 3 (01:03:12):
Right right?
Speaker 5 (01:03:13):
Yeah, you know, it's not just some fancy exotic kind
of thing. But it's the you know, it's it's the
real versus the fake. And that is always our struggle
as human beings on this earth is always what is real?
What is fake?
Speaker 1 (01:03:30):
Yeah?
Speaker 5 (01:03:32):
And I subscribe that Asian American men have a place
in this, in our story of America.
Speaker 1 (01:03:40):
You know, yes, I really appreciate you sharing your POV.
I know you started it by saying there are going
to be some people who may disagree or who find
it offensive, but you know, truly being willing to speak
out and say your experience. You have a POV that
certainly the three other people on this zoom with you
don't have. We can't we can't speak from your POV.
(01:04:02):
And so for you being willing to say it and
to share your honesty with us, Like you said, your
generation is the generation that helped propel and make these changes,
but there are still more strides that need to be
taken and that that need to happen. And so thank
you for sharing that thought with us and your perspective
with us.
Speaker 5 (01:04:22):
Yeah, I can tell you one thing. Uh you look
at what the women's movement has done. Mhmm. You can
get kicked off for show. Now if you sexually harass somebody, right,
you can get your career can be destroyed if you
if you engage in those activities. Well, in my time,
(01:04:45):
those activities were common.
Speaker 1 (01:04:48):
Yeah, it was.
Speaker 5 (01:04:49):
You had to expect it if you wanted to be
an actress, if you wanted to be successful, not only
an actress, as actress too, you have to succumb to it.
You'd have to accept this.
Speaker 1 (01:04:58):
Yeah, it was just part of the job.
Speaker 5 (01:04:59):
Yeah, part of the gig. Right, So now that's changed.
But can you stop with somebody from harassing you racially?
Speaker 1 (01:05:10):
Hm hmmm No, yeah, not yet.
Speaker 5 (01:05:14):
Not yet. So I mean, uh, maybe my my look
at life is skewed, skewed, you know, twisted, and it
is it is because going back to when I was
a kid, I was not accepted by the general public.
So my view of life is kind of skewed. Skewed. Yeah, yeah,
(01:05:36):
So I I ask you for your understanding and forgiveness
for having that kind of like view as a Yogo
d h h. But I am one h but because
of who I am, because of the race I am,
because of the class I am, I have been twisted,
(01:05:57):
so you must forgive my twisted view.
Speaker 1 (01:06:01):
Well, Keoni, we have been so honored to have you
as a part of the Boy Meets World legacy, an
actor with almost three hundred credits to his name, so
many memorable roles and projects. We really thank you very
much for spending your time and coming on the podcast
and talking with us. It was we thank you a real.
Speaker 2 (01:06:20):
Joy, amazing.
Speaker 5 (01:06:22):
Well, I am honored as well. I know about your
careers and I am very honored as well to be
accepted by you.
Speaker 1 (01:06:32):
Thank you for spending your time with us. We really
really appreciate it. And I hope it's not the last time.
Speaker 2 (01:06:37):
Hope.
Speaker 1 (01:06:37):
I hope our paths cross again. I mean, who would
have predicted that almost thirty years later, our paths would
cross here on this podcast, So I hope it's not
the last time. Thank you so much, Thank you very much.
Speaker 5 (01:06:49):
I am honored, have a wonderful day. Bye bye.
Speaker 1 (01:06:53):
What a great conversation.
Speaker 2 (01:06:55):
Yeah, amazing.
Speaker 4 (01:06:57):
Yeah, again, his career is staggering, the things that he's done.
It's just and the idea that even with that career,
he kind of it seems like he kind of still
looks at himself as almost a failure, which is straight.
Speaker 3 (01:07:11):
And you know what, he's just a journeyman. You know,
he's just like like when he calls himself an artisan
and was like, right, because you're never done, like you're
always this is about process, this is about acting, this
is about learning, like he still wants to learn new
skills and new things. That's so cool, man, What a great, healthy,
artistic perspective. You know, I'm sure it's led to a
lot of periods of you know, difficulty and feeling bad
(01:07:35):
about himself, but ultimately like he's succeeded because he it
doesn't matter what project he's in, he's always going to
be doing it, and he's always doing it one hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (01:07:42):
Like yeah, I also.
Speaker 4 (01:07:45):
At a comic con and you know, he he talks
about how he you know, he's a little disturbed by
the cult like uh, you know, stigma that that surrounds
anime and things like that. But I can also tell
you just from experience of watching him, he's so good
with his fans. I mean, it's one of those things
where he's still just so open with everybody that was
(01:08:05):
waiting in line. Again, he had a line, you know
that that's sitting there waiting to talk to him. And
so yeah, he might have that internally and he might
talk about that, but if you're a fan and you
go up to him, he's still going to show you
just the utmost respect and and you're gonna have a
great experience when you when you see him.
Speaker 1 (01:08:21):
Yeah, I know, but like will, like you said it,
it uh the the impact his families and and and
the peers of his parents, that their opinion of him
is still just so forefront of his mind that it
(01:08:42):
feels like there's a it makes me emotional to think about, Like,
you know, we look at him and his career and
we're like awe struck by all of like, Wow, look
what you've been able to do, Look what you've been
able to accomplish. And you can tell that for him,
he it does. It's it's I don't know, it just
feel if I don't know, it makes me emotional.
Speaker 3 (01:09:01):
It's interesting like me, you know, cause I've talked about
being friends with Larry Pressman, who's an older actor, and
I remember one of the first times talking to him
about people he knew, like great actors who were always
ashamed that they were an actor, and that does seem
like a generational thing, like especially for certain guys of
certain age, like you know that that were acting in
like the fifties or sixties, it felt like a cheap career,
(01:09:24):
like it felt like you were sort of avoiding a
real job by being an actor and by just being
a pretty face or you know, like there was an
inscution And I remember hearing him say that and being like,
oh wow, Like I think I had some of that too,
Like I think I was often like, well, I don't
want to just be an actor, like it just it's
something right and it's like, wait a minute, this is
an amazing thing, like that skill and the ability to
do it and like embrace it. So yeah, when I
(01:09:46):
heard him say that, I was like, oh, yeah, you're
never going to let that go that you didn't you know,
become a doctor or whatever, but in reality what you
did accomplish is insane. Yeah, Like it's so much like, yeah,
so much more rare. But I do think that nowadays
a lot of people, especially people who were listening to
something like this podcast, you think of actors or acting
as like automatically just a cool job. I think for
(01:10:08):
other generations and other contexts, it's not. It's actually like
kind of like being a Carney vaudeville like that's like this,
you know, the superficial job, this like weird thing that
you do that maybe you'll get lucky, but it's not
a real person's job.
Speaker 2 (01:10:22):
As we just lost all of our carneye fans.
Speaker 3 (01:10:26):
Sney, I think being a Carney is awesome.
Speaker 1 (01:10:29):
I know when we go on our live show and
we go on our live show tours, I'll never forget.
I don't remember where we were, but there was some
some green room that we had that was like really
not anything pleasurable, and I was like, oh man, this
green room kind of makes me sad that like this
(01:10:52):
is where we are, and writers like, I love it.
This is what we're doing.
Speaker 3 (01:10:56):
We're into some awful, disgusting room and then we make
a show.
Speaker 1 (01:11:03):
Out we do the ND.
Speaker 3 (01:11:06):
Yeah, I love it.
Speaker 1 (01:11:08):
That's a cool that's a cool way of thinking about it,
and it has changed the way I feel when I
walk into a really musty green.
Speaker 3 (01:11:17):
I kind of like it. I like they're weird and
like you got these like do you remember that one
time I couldn't find the coffee machine. It took like
twenty minutes. It was like that whole other warehouse room.
We don't know what it's for.
Speaker 1 (01:11:27):
It's like, I don't want people to think we're we're
of under selling what this I mean. I'm truly talking
about the dankest.
Speaker 2 (01:11:36):
Yeah, it's like.
Speaker 3 (01:11:37):
A lot of backstages they don't care. It's that's the
point is that you care about. You take care of
the stage, you take care of the house, the front house,
but backstage is like it's just terrible.
Speaker 1 (01:11:48):
It's just for the some some you know, bugs and
very very very bare bones. Feels like maybe an unclean
hospital space. Uh and so.
Speaker 2 (01:11:59):
Wait to do it again. Can't wait and do it again,
Carni Folk.
Speaker 1 (01:12:05):
Thank you all for listening to this episode of Podmeets World.
As always, you can follow us on Instagram pod meets
World Show. You can send us your messages, you can
send us your thoughts, your emails. Podmeets Worldshow at gmail
dot com and we've got merch.
Speaker 2 (01:12:17):
Step Bridup, buy some merch. Guess you wait, step bradup.
Speaker 1 (01:12:22):
Podmeetsworldshow dot com. We love you all, pod dismissed.
Speaker 3 (01:12:29):
Podmeets World is an iHeart podcast producer hosted by Danielle Fischel,
Wilfridell and Ryder Straw Executive producers Jensen Karp and Amy
Sugarman Executive in charge of production, Danielle Romo, producer and editor,
Tarasubash producer, Maddie Moore engineer and Boy meets World Superman
Easton out Our theme song is by Kyle Morton of Typhoon.
Follow us on Instagram at Podmets World Show, or email
(01:12:51):
us at Podmeets World Show at gmail dot com
Hosts And Creators
Will Friedle
Danielle Fishel
Rider Strong
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